Syncro Fuel Tank

When my pinion bearing gave up and the transmission had to come out,
it looked like the ideal opportunity to drop the tank and try to
find a reason for the very slow fill rate that plagues many Syncros
over the 60 litre / 16 gallon mark. The workshop, established in VW
work for 50 years, had never taken one out before.

They reported extreme difficulty in getting it out because it fouled
on just about everything, and even more difficulty in getting it
back in - many hours of frustrating work for two mechanics in each
case. It is reasonably obvious that on original factory assembly,
the tank went in before anything else.

Can anyone with experience in removing the Syncro tank relate their
experiences?

Les Harris
Syncro_T3_Australia
Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Syncro Fuel Tank
Les

How about this info? I thought I’d read something when I was panicking I had a leak.

http://www.vanagon.com/syncros/technica/remove-gas-tank/index.html

Gary
 

When my pinion bearing gave up and the transmission had to come out,
it looked like the ideal opportunity to drop the tank and try to
find a reason for the very slow fill rate that plagues many Syncros
over the 60 litre / 16 gallon mark. The workshop, established in VW
work for 50 years, had never taken one out before.

They reported extreme difficulty in getting it out because it fouled
on just about everything, and even more difficulty in getting it
back in - many hours of frustrating work for two mechanics in each
case. It is reasonably obvious that on original factory assembly,
the tank went in before anything else.

Can anyone with experience in removing the Syncro tank relate their
experiences?

Les Harris
Syncro_T3_Australia

 
    

I have taken it out and put it back in. 1/3 filled with diesel, alone :)

The fuel filling problem is the result of clogged venting system, you
need to replace the tubes and/or the 2 white valves on top of the
tank. 5 months ago these were still available at VAG (around 9 EUR
each). Unless you have a brand new level sender in the garage, i would
not recommend you take take it out of the tank - it is very very
expensive. The most common problem is actually not the fuel tank
itself, but the straps that hold it in place. When i tried to loosen
them, I killed one screw, which was stuck due to severe oxidation. Had
to drill it out and fortunately was able to put in a new thread of the
same size. The straps itself needed to be replaced. Most people
replace them with v2a aftermarket straps that come in at around 120
EUR per set, but will never fail again. I managed to get some used and
powder coated straps for half the price and gave them a good waxing
before i put them back in - hope they will outlive the rest of the
bus. About the process of taking out and putting back in: The tank is
somewhat asymmetrical, which leaves only one way out and the same way
back in :) Sitting in the engine compartment with tail lights in the
back, looking at the tank: You have the two main studs of the bus,
which the tank sits on - on both sides. On the left side with the
level sender, on the right side with the filling tube coming in. The
filler needs to be taken out before. It is a metal tube sticking into
the tank. You will also need to loosen both fuel lines and already
stick them back into the holes where they are coming from, as you
won't have time when balancing around with the fuel tank in your
hands :) Then loosen both straps and completely remove them - the tank
will stay in place, as it sits on the mentioned main studs. The side
with the fuel sender is the shortest and is meant to come out first.
There is also the main wiring harness with the cable going to the rear
difflock's switch. Sometimes the stuff needs to be loosened a bit and
moved outwards a little. Anyway, the trick about getting it out, is to
push the tank further into the direction of the filling tube that has
already been removed. It needs to be pushed a little up and a little
to the right until the left side with the fuel sender can come down
easily. Be careful not to hit the main stud with the fuel sender too
often, you might break it... Back in the same way. Push the filling
side of the tank up into the upper left corner until you can lift the
fuel sender side over the main stud. In the end the tank sits on both
sides right on the stud. I see what pictures i can find and attach some.

Good luck,

martin

p.s.: I have absolutely no clue what "main stud" might have been in
English for a native... hope you understand anyway :D
p.p.s.: Pictures:

* new used straps, big part: http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ49473F45.jpg
* upper parts selfmade: http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ7872E0C9.jpg
* screw needs to come out... http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ1E5A2482.jpg
* fuel sender: http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ3E2CA77B.jpg
* before ANYthing goes back in, rust removal, waxing... http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ536B5D16.jpg
* all fuell and venting lines replaced: http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ149B4566.jpg
* broke one venting valve while removing the tank, replaced it: http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ6A6C7CC5.jpg
* back in the game, lower part: http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ3DEEBF0B.jpg
* ... and upper part: http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ47002E2E.jpg

Have fun..................



On 06.06.2008, at 07:11, Les Harris wrote:

> When my pinion bearing gave up and the transmission had to come out,
> it looked like the ideal opportunity to drop the tank and try to
> find a reason for the very slow fill rate that plagues many Syncros
> over the 60 litre / 16 gallon mark. The workshop, established in VW
> work for 50 years, had never taken one out before.
>
> They reported extreme difficulty in getting it out because it fouled
> on just about everything, and even more difficulty in getting it
> back in - many hours of frustrating work for two mechanics in each
> case. It is reasonably obvious that on original factory assembly,
> the tank went in before anything else.
>
> Can anyone with experience in removing the Syncro tank relate their
> experiences?
>
> Les Harris
> Syncro_T3_Australia
>
>
>



--
Martin Henning, DM5OY
martin@easy2design.de
http://log.tigerbus.de
Hi Martin,
There is a known design problem (from VAG literature) of the filling problem on unleaded fuel tanks which have a different filler neck than your diesel tank.
Phill

> Martin Henning <martin@easy2design.de> wrote:
>
> I have taken it out and put it back in. 1/3 filled with diesel, alone :)
>
> The fuel filling problem is the result of clogged venting system, you
> need to replace the tubes and/or the 2 white valves on top of the
> tank. 5 months ago these were still available at VAG (around 9 EUR
> each). Unless you have a brand new level sender in the garage, i would
> not recommend you take take it out of the tank - it is very very
> expensive. The most common problem is actually not the fuel tank
> itself, but the straps that hold it in place. When i tried to loosen
> them, I killed one screw, which was stuck due to severe oxidation. Had
> to drill it out and fortunately was able to put in a new thread of the
> same size. The straps itself needed to be replaced. Most people
> replace them with v2a aftermarket straps that come in at around 120
> EUR per set, but will never fail again. I managed to get some used and
> powder coated straps for half the price and gave them a good waxing
> before i put them back in - hope they will outlive the rest of the
> bus. About the process of taking out and putting back in: The tank is
> somewhat asymmetrical, which leaves only one way out and the same way
> back in :) Sitting in the engine compartment with tail lights in the
> back, looking at the tank: You have the two main studs of the bus,
> which the tank sits on - on both sides. On the left side with the
> level sender, on the right side with the filling tube coming in. The
> filler needs to be taken out before. It is a metal tube sticking into
> the tank. You will also need to loosen both fuel lines and already
> stick them back into the holes where they are coming from, as you
> won't have time when balancing around with the fuel tank in your
> hands :) Then loosen both straps and completely remove them - the tank
> will stay in place, as it sits on the mentioned main studs. The side
> with the fuel sender is the shortest and is meant to come out first.
> There is also the main wiring harness with the cable going to the rear
> difflock's switch. Sometimes the stuff needs to be loosened a bit and
> moved outwards a little. Anyway, the trick about getting it out, is to
> push the tank further into the direction of the filling tube that has
> already been removed. It needs to be pushed a little up and a little
> to the right until the left side with the fuel sender can come down
> easily. Be careful not to hit the main stud with the fuel sender too
> often, you might break it... Back in the same way. Push the filling
> side of the tank up into the upper left corner until you can lift the
> fuel sender side over the main stud. In the end the tank sits on both
> sides right on the stud. I see what pictures i can find and attach some.
>
> Good luck,
>
> martin
>
> p.s.: I have absolutely no clue what "main stud" might have been in
> English for a native... hope you understand anyway :D
> p.p.s.: Pictures:
>
> * new used straps, big part:
> http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ49473F45.jpg
> * upper parts selfmade: http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ7872E0C9.jpg
> * screw needs to come out...
> http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ1E5A2482.jpg
> * fuel sender: http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ3E2CA77B.jpg
> * before ANYthing goes back in, rust removal, waxing...
> http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ536B5D16.jpg
> * all fuell and venting lines replaced:
> http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ149B4566.jpg
> * broke one venting valve while removing the tank, replaced it:
> http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ6A6C7CC5.jpg
> * back in the game, lower part:
> http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ3DEEBF0B.jpg
> * ... and upper part: http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ47002E2E.jpg
>
> Have fun..................
>
>
>
> On 06.06.2008, at 07:11, Les Harris wrote:
>
> > When my pinion bearing gave up and the transmission had to come out,
> > it looked like the ideal opportunity to drop the tank and try to
> > find a reason for the very slow fill rate that plagues many Syncros
> > over the 60 litre / 16 gallon mark. The workshop, established in VW
> > work for 50 years, had never taken one out before.
> >
> > They reported extreme difficulty in getting it out because it fouled
> > on just about everything, and even more difficulty in getting it
> > back in - many hours of frustrating work for two mechanics in each
> > case. It is reasonably obvious that on original factory assembly,
> > the tank went in before anything else.
> >
> > Can anyone with experience in removing the Syncro tank relate their
> > experiences?
> >
> > Les Harris
> > Syncro_T3_Australia
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Martin Henning, DM5OY
> martin@easy2design.de
> http://log.tigerbus.de
Phill,
 
Did VAG offer any solutions?
 
So far, I have established that the shut-off valves were functioning properly and that the carbon canister was passing air easily.  When I get it back, I will check on Yurik's observation on the kinked filler pipe.
 
Les
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, June 07, 2008 12:40 AM
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Syncro Fuel Tank

Hi Martin,
There is a known design problem (from VAG literature) of the filling problem on unleaded fuel tanks which have a different filler neck than your diesel tank.
Phill

.

Phill,

as far as i know, every German non-diesel Syncro could relate the
problems to the freaky layout of breather piping and/or the 2 valves
on top of the tank. Also people discovered, that the end of the
breather pipe which ends right at the filler sometimes simply fell of
and got filled with water and dirt. This even lead to some people's
engines break down due to water in the tank - very very simple cause
for an annoying problem :)

.martin, admittedly diesel-only driver

On 06.06.2008, at 16:40, plander@optusnet.com.au wrote:

> Hi Martin,
> There is a known design problem (from VAG literature) of the filling
> problem on unleaded fuel tanks which have a different filler neck
> than your diesel tank.
> Phill
>
>> Martin Henning <martin@easy2design.de> wrote:
>>
>> I have taken it out and put it back in. 1/3 filled with diesel,
>> alone :)
>>
>> The fuel filling problem is the result of clogged venting system, you
>> need to replace the tubes and/or the 2 white valves on top of the
>> tank. 5 months ago these were still available at VAG (around 9 EUR
>> each). Unless you have a brand new level sender in the garage, i
>> would
>> not recommend you take take it out of the tank - it is very very
>> expensive. The most common problem is actually not the fuel tank
>> itself, but the straps that hold it in place. When i tried to loosen
>> them, I killed one screw, which was stuck due to severe oxidation.
>> Had
>> to drill it out and fortunately was able to put in a new thread of
>> the
>> same size. The straps itself needed to be replaced. Most people
>> replace them with v2a aftermarket straps that come in at around 120
>> EUR per set, but will never fail again. I managed to get some used
>> and
>> powder coated straps for half the price and gave them a good waxing
>> before i put them back in - hope they will outlive the rest of the
>> bus. About the process of taking out and putting back in: The tank is
>> somewhat asymmetrical, which leaves only one way out and the same way
>> back in :) Sitting in the engine compartment with tail lights in the
>> back, looking at the tank: You have the two main studs of the bus,
>> which the tank sits on - on both sides. On the left side with the
>> level sender, on the right side with the filling tube coming in. The
>> filler needs to be taken out before. It is a metal tube sticking into
>> the tank. You will also need to loosen both fuel lines and already
>> stick them back into the holes where they are coming from, as you
>> won't have time when balancing around with the fuel tank in your
>> hands :) Then loosen both straps and completely remove them - the
>> tank
>> will stay in place, as it sits on the mentioned main studs. The side
>> with the fuel sender is the shortest and is meant to come out first.
>> There is also the main wiring harness with the cable going to the
>> rear
>> difflock's switch. Sometimes the stuff needs to be loosened a bit and
>> moved outwards a little. Anyway, the trick about getting it out, is
>> to
>> push the tank further into the direction of the filling tube that has
>> already been removed. It needs to be pushed a little up and a little
>> to the right until the left side with the fuel sender can come down
>> easily. Be careful not to hit the main stud with the fuel sender too
>> often, you might break it... Back in the same way. Push the filling
>> side of the tank up into the upper left corner until you can lift the
>> fuel sender side over the main stud. In the end the tank sits on both
>> sides right on the stud. I see what pictures i can find and attach
>> some.
>>
>> Good luck,
>>
>> martin
>>
>> p.s.: I have absolutely no clue what "main stud" might have been in
>> English for a native... hope you understand anyway :D
>> p.p.s.: Pictures:
>>
>> * new used straps, big part:
>> http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ49473F45.jpg
>> * upper parts selfmade: http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/
>> ZZ7872E0C9.jpg
>> * screw needs to come out...
>> http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ1E5A2482.jpg
>> * fuel sender: http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ3E2CA77B.jpg
>> * before ANYthing goes back in, rust removal, waxing...
>> http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ536B5D16.jpg
>> * all fuell and venting lines replaced:
>> http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ149B4566.jpg
>> * broke one venting valve while removing the tank, replaced it:
>> http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ6A6C7CC5.jpg
>> * back in the game, lower part:
>> http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ3DEEBF0B.jpg
>> * ... and upper part: http://www.easy2design.de/stuff/ZZ47002E2E.jpg
>>
>> Have fun..................
>>
>>
>>
>> On 06.06.2008, at 07:11, Les Harris wrote:
>>
>>> When my pinion bearing gave up and the transmission had to come out,
>>> it looked like the ideal opportunity to drop the tank and try to
>>> find a reason for the very slow fill rate that plagues many Syncros
>>> over the 60 litre / 16 gallon mark. The workshop, established in VW
>>> work for 50 years, had never taken one out before.
>>>
>>> They reported extreme difficulty in getting it out because it fouled
>>> on just about everything, and even more difficulty in getting it
>>> back in - many hours of frustrating work for two mechanics in each
>>> case. It is reasonably obvious that on original factory assembly,
>>> the tank went in before anything else.
>>>
>>> Can anyone with experience in removing the Syncro tank relate their
>>> experiences?
>>>
>>> Les Harris
>>> Syncro_T3_Australia
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Martin Henning, DM5OY
>> martin@easy2design.de
>> http://log.tigerbus.de
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>



--
Martin Henning, DM5OY
martin@easy2design.de
http://log.tigerbus.de
> Did VAG offer any solutions?
>
Yes, the documentation says it is not a warranty problem and to fill slowly.