Coolant hoses

1
Has anyone ordered a complete set of coolant hoses from VAN CAFE. At $us375.00 (250) it seems like a reasonable solution to out of stock situation in Aust. Provided postage is not over the top. Bill
2
Hi Bill ,
Am in the process of ordering the syncro set and have been quoted $81.62 with UPS , 4 to 15 days delivery. I am in Perth

Cheers
Philippe

On 24 February 2012 11:41, Bill <marg_bill@westnet.com.au> wrote:

Has anyone ordered a complete set of coolant hoses from VAN CAFE. At $us375.00 (250) it seems like a reasonable solution to out of stock situation in Aust. Provided postage is not over the top. Bill




--
Philippe Tyack
Mobile:+61450059162
3
Philippe. Thanks. That postage seems ok. A new set of hoses should help a lot with reliability issues in 20+ year old vans. I suspect few of our 2.1 engines just wear out but get cooked with cooling failure. Bill
4
Yes ,that's my take on it ,rather be safe than sorry
Philippe

On 24 February 2012 12:00, Bill <marg_bill@westnet.com.au> wrote:

Philippe. Thanks. That postage seems ok. A new set of hoses should help a lot with reliability issues in 20+ year old vans. I suspect few of our 2.1 engines just wear out but get cooked with cooling failure. Bill




--
Philippe Tyack
Mobile:+61450059162
5
Be careful of replacing perfectly good genuine VW parts with new aftermarket. You could be making it more unreliable. You need to take a commonsense approach. If the original looks brand new, keep it. If it looks like it has been sitting on the floor of the ocean for years, replace it.

A lot of people have made that mistake and it is hard to go back.

The aftermarket small hose that you buy by the metre is actually fuel hose. The correct water hose 443 121 107A is available for $35 from VW dealers for 5 metres.

Phill



> Bill <marg_bill@westnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> Philippe. Thanks. That postage seems ok. A new set of hoses should help
> a lot with reliability issues in 20+ year old vans. I suspect few of our
> 2.1 engines just wear out but get cooked with cooling failure. Bill
6
Phil. Noted. This kit is sold as a combination of Genuine vw,aftermarket, and silicon hoses that van cafe have had manufactured. The hoses that have failed on my van 251 121 103, 251 121 072a, and 251 121 102. They all come off the H PIPE COOLANT JUNCTION. They are no longer available in australia, as is the junction. So may as well get the full set. Bill
7

Bill,

 

I got a set of hoses from Van Café and the service re delivery was excellent. There are one or two hoses that they do not include, one is a heater hose that runs under the van from one side to the other at the engine end. This can be replaced with some heater hose and Unicoils to allow the hose to bend.

 

Re the comment regarding the 20 year old hoses most of the ones taken off my T3 where still in good condition. The local RAC told me that 10 to 12 years is about the maximum life that you can expect so this proves that VW do use good gear!

 

I also purchased a new radiator and stainless steel junction tree from these guys.

 

Cheers,

 

Dave WA

8
Yes some hoses fail more than others. The others you would just have for spares. I would replace the oil cooler ones if you are working in that area. They are cheap, hard to change and do cause problems.



> Bill <marg_bill@westnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> Phil. Noted. This kit is sold as a combination of Genuine
> vw,aftermarket, and silicon hoses that van cafe have had manufactured.
> The hoses that have failed on my van 251 121 103, 251 121 072a, and 251
> 121 102. They all come off the H PIPE COOLANT JUNCTION. They are no
> longer available in australia, as is the junction. So may as well get
> the full set. Bill
9
Dave. Thanks. it's reassuring to know these guys give good service before sending off my hard earned. Bill
10
About the external appearance of coolant hoses ..
look at the inside of hoses sometimes..
often the outside will look fine, but the inside surface will show signs of deterioration.

of course...any hose that feels mushy and soft if 'really getting there.'
The ones that run the hottest go first.
That one going off the front of the right cylinder head ....S shaped and about 6 inches long ..
I've seen a few of those blow. 

in general, I find many of the original VW T3 hoses to be just excellent and very, very long lasting .
I gather you guys run in very hot temps a lot, and may have more stress going on than T3 vans in other places in the world.

'Water Wetter' ..
btw.........that stuff works. ( or similar products by other companies ) .. Read what it says on the side of the bottle , very useful and interesting.  Pure water With water Wetter added removes heat the best, according to what it says on the bottle.  Racing cars generally run pure water I read.
I use Water Wetter  for sure where really high temps and heat loads are a concern.
( of course ..failure of the ends of the main plastic cooling pipes ....that occurs. I have seen some fine vans in the boneyard ...just due to that failure. )

Stay cool !
Scott
www.turbovans.com

On 2/23/2012 8:34 PM, plander@optusnet.com.au wrote:
 

Be careful of replacing perfectly good genuine VW parts with new aftermarket. You could be making it more unreliable. You need to take a commonsense approach. If the original looks brand new, keep it. If it looks like it has been sitting on the floor of the ocean for years, replace it.

A lot of people have made that mistake and it is hard to go back.

The aftermarket small hose that you buy by the metre is actually fuel hose. The correct water hose 443 121 107A is available for $35 from VW dealers for 5 metres.

Phill

> Bill <marg_bill@westnet.com.au> wrote:
>
> Philippe. Thanks. That postage seems ok. A new set of hoses should help
> a lot with reliability issues in 20+ year old vans. I suspect few of our
> 2.1 engines just wear out but get cooked with cooling failure. Bill

11
My bus decided to impersonate a steam train today. Fearing the worst of course, check it over and was one of the hoses on the thermostat. I was lucky as it was only a tiny hole and must have happened just before we stopped, so I managed to patch it and get home fine, hardly lost any coolant.
The hose however looks like a hard to get one:
http://www.van-cafe.com/home/van/page_474_1141/h20-pump-pipe-to-thermostat-housing-hose.html

Are any local vendors likely to have this? Don't want to be off the road too long

Also, is there any way to get an early warning of an issue? If this happened on a long trip, could have lost a lot of coolant without realising.

I'm also thinking a complete kit could be a good idea, has anyone used this kit, or are there better places to get them?
http://www.van-cafe.com/home/van/page_194_1141/syncro-coolant-hose-kit-1986-1991.html
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/archive/index.php/o-t--t-513918--.html
Its scary just how many parts are in the cooling system!

Richard
12
Richard. I bought the van cafe full 19 piece hose kit a few years ago and so far used the two on the oil cooler,the top one on the thermostat and a couple off the 4 way manifold ( now stainless steel) all fitted well. All appear good quality. Great insurance to have under the seat . If i remember Ken also bought the kit and i think fitted the complete set. He'd have a better idea. Bill
13

Just get a hose the right diameter with a bend in it from a store like Repco or Supercheap and cut it to length.

cheers
Doone Wyborn

On Oct 12, 2014 11:24 PM, "cathrich1@yahoo.com.au [Syncro_T3_Australia]" <Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

My bus decided to impersonate a steam train today. Fearing the worst of course, check it over and was one of the hoses on the thermostat. I was lucky as it was only a tiny hole and must have happened just before we stopped, so I managed to patch it and get home fine, hardly lost any coolant.
The hose however looks like a hard to get one:
http://www.van-cafe.com/home/van/page_474_1141/h20-pump-pipe-to-thermostat-housing-hose.html

Are any local vendors likely to have this? Don't want to be off the road too long

Also, is there any way to get an early warning of an issue? If this happened on a long trip, could have lost a lot of coolant without realising.

I'm also thinking a complete kit could be a good idea, has anyone used this kit, or are there better places to get them?
http://www.van-cafe.com/home/van/page_194_1141/syncro-coolant-hose-kit-1986-1991.html
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/archive/index.php/o-t--t-513918--.html
Its scary just how many parts are in the cooling system!

Richard

14

Richard,

If you look in the Files section of the Syncro_T3_Australia website, you will find a very comprehensive document authored by Ken.  It is a compilation of coolant hoses for the MV engine, giving original numbers and alternative sources of supply.

Re coolant loss:

The temperature instruments normally fitted to motor vehicles are grossly inadequate when it comes to catastrophic coolant loss.  You can lose the entire contents of the cooling system before the average temp gauge responds, by which time it is far too late. 

The only device which tells you before you have lost the lot is based on the presence of / absence of coolant. 

They usually consist of two probes close together in the coolant, through which a current passes.  So long as they are surrounded by liquid, the current flows between the probes.  The moment the liquid drops below the level of the probes, the current stops flowing and a loud alarm is triggered on the dash – usually a shrieking piezo!!

It follows that, the higher up in the coolant system the probes are mounted, the more warning you get.  (It is on the ignition circuit and runs only when the ignition is on.) 

This is an absolutely positive warning system; coolant present = OK, coolant absent = loud alarm.  This gives you time to get off the road and shut off the engine.

I find that Davies Craig released a warning kit last year and I will try to get full details –

http://www.daviescraig.com.au/Controller___Switches-LOW_COOLANT_LEVEL_ALARM_KIT___PART_No__1030-details.aspx    

Davies Craig make very good quality gear and I would expect this to be no different.  (We used a lot of DC gear in our test gear at General Motors.)

Les

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: 13 October 2014 00:24
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Coolant hoses

My bus decided to impersonate a steam train today. Fearing the worst of course, check it over and was one of the hoses on the thermostat. I was lucky as it was only a tiny hole and must have happened just before we stopped, so I managed to patch it and get home fine, hardly lost any coolant.
The hose however looks like a hard to get one:
http://www.van-cafe.com/home/van/page_474_1141/h20-pump-pipe-to-thermostat-housing-hose.html

Are any local vendors likely to have this? Don't want to be off the road too long

Also, is there any way to get an early warning of an issue? If this happened on a long trip, could have lost a lot of coolant without realising

I'm also thinking a complete kit could be a good idea, has anyone used this kit, or are there better places to get them?
http://www.van-cafe.com/home/van/page_194_1141/syncro-coolant-hose-kit-1986-1991.html
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/archive/index.php/o-t--t-513918--.html
Its scary just how many parts are in the cooling system!

Richard

15
Thanks Les, had not realised those files were there, great reading.
On the kit, this doubles up with the factory one in the header tank, I'm just not sure how quick you notice loss of coolant from the header tank?

Thanks also for the tip on finding a suitable hose, will have a look tomorrow at repco.
16
Hi Richard, Bill and all,
Yes I replaced the lot as per supplied kit from VanCafe in 2010, back then there were only 3 silicone hoses included, I see there are now ten listed among the individual hoses. Not sure how many silicone hoses are in the present kit given stated changing circumstances of supply and VanCafe not updating kit list.

I tried hard but gave up on a complete/partial local auto parts store substitution hose route, even after obtaining/searching manufacturer hose catalogues. Simply a case of auto parts retailers these days carrying relatively few hoses for eye-balling and hands on comparisons. It was near impossible to marry substitution hoses that meet our vans shape/diameter/length hoses from the limited range seen. A complete waste of time and effort, except perhaps in a one off emergency scenario. Better to carry spares and/or an emergency special purpose repair bandage to get out of trouble. For peace of mind, replace all hoses if you have no knowledge/record of any/all hoses age/condition. 

Bare in mind the kit doesn't address at all the complete run of hoses that reticulates coolant through the front heater.
I'm unaware of past forum discussion on heater hose R&R nor of anyone who has actually carried it out. Ticking time bomb?

For genuine rubber hoses that are of correct fit and diameter size, my suggestion is to stick with original spring clips, they hold best 24/7 compared with screw-ups that need rechecking every so often, including the special screw-up clips supplied with the silicone hoses. I tend to think the silicone hoses, once fitted, will probably last longer than your van ownership, unlike the rubber range.

Finally and after due consideration at the time (2010), I chose to repair the two long nylon coolant pipes, rather than replace with stainless. It's an individual choice, based on weighing up a number of considerations including but not limited to, present state of hose ends and methodology chosen to repair plus employing or not the available GoWesty repair kit plus double clipping all nylon pipe/hose connections.

Cheers.
Ken
   



To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2014 06:49:23 -0700
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Coolant hoses

 
Richard. I bought the van cafe full 19 piece hose kit a few years ago and so far used the two on the oil cooler,the top one on the thermostat and a couple off the 4 way manifold ( now stainless steel) all fitted well. All appear good quality. Great insurance to have under the seat . If i remember Ken also bought the kit and i think fitted the complete set. He'd have a better idea. Bill

17

Thanks for the detailed reply Ken, I will certainly be adding the complete kit to the ever growing wish list for the Bus.

I have looked at the SS pipes front to back, certainly interesting you decided to keep the originals. Not that I know, but I would have thought any original ones out there would have a finite life left in them. Not sure if there would be any potential issues going to stainless.

I understand you comment on the clips, unfortunately my bus has a number of hose clips already there, so am at the moment forced to re-use them.

For the moment I have found a suitable candidate locally, Repco luckily let me into there wearhouse, they had a rack probably 4m x 2m of various hoses I sorted through.


Now comes the fun of actually replacing and bleeding the system, not a task I'm looking forward to!!


Thanks again every one for your help and assistance.


Richard



---In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, <unclekenz@...> wrote :

Hi Richard, Bill and all,
Yes I replaced the lot as per supplied kit from VanCafe in 2010, back then there were only 3 silicone hoses included, I see there are now ten listed among the individual hoses. Not sure how many silicone hoses are in the present kit given stated changing circumstances of supply and VanCafe not updating kit list.

I tried hard but gave up on a complete/partial local auto parts store substitution hose route, even after obtaining/searching manufacturer hose catalogues. Simply a case of auto parts retailers these days carrying relatively few hoses for eye-balling and hands on comparisons. It was near impossible to marry substitution hoses that meet our vans shape/diameter/length hoses from the limited range seen. A complete waste of time and effort, except perhaps in a one off emergency scenario. Better to carry spares and/or an emergency special purpose repair bandage to get out of trouble. For peace of mind, replace all hoses if you have no knowledge/record of any/all hoses age/condition. 

Bare in mind the kit doesn't address at all the complete run of hoses that reticulates coolant through the front heater.
I'm unaware of past forum discussion on heater hose R&R nor of anyone who has actually carried it out. Ticking time bomb?

For genuine rubber hoses that are of correct fit and diameter size, my suggestion is to stick with original spring clips, they hold best 24/7 compared with screw-ups that need rechecking every so often, including the special screw-up clips supplied with the silicone hoses. I tend to think the silicone hoses, once fitted, will probably last longer than your van ownership, unlike the rubber range.

Finally and after due consideration at the time (2010), I chose to repair the two long nylon coolant pipes, rather than replace with stainless. It's an individual choice, based on weighing up a number of considerations including but not limited to, present state of hose ends and methodology chosen to repair plus employing or not the available GoWesty repair kit plus double clipping all nylon pipe/hose connections.

Cheers.
Ken
   



To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2014 06:49:23 -0700
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Coolant hoses

 
Richard. I bought the van cafe full 19 piece hose kit a few years ago and so far used the two on the oil cooler,the top one on the thermostat and a couple off the 4 way manifold ( now stainless steel) all fitted well. All appear good quality. Great insurance to have under the seat . If i remember Ken also bought the kit and i think fitted the complete set. He'd have a better idea. Bill

18

Thanks again everyone for your help. I have put the complete hose kit on the wish list for now. With the use of the handy document in the files section, the local Repco let me loose in the store room, got a crummydore hose (gates brand) that I cut the right size piece out of and fitted to the bus, was straight forward and didn't loose much coolant. Bleed the system and was back on the road quickly!

I read up both the files here and the Bentley for the bleeding procedure, it seemed straight forward enough. Why do so many people seem to get it wrong? What are the common mistakes people make?

Out of interest, when the hose first leaked, I taped up the hose and surprisingly it seemed water tight for the trip home (~10km). I also bought a silicon repair "supatape". Not sure how good it is, but seems like cheap insurance and usable on coolant, oil, fuel etc

http://www.abseals.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Flyer-SupaTape-Ver120229.pdf

Richard


19

Hi to all the experts out there. Gearbox is out for a refurb by Ron in Kempsey. It was looking great until we checked the pinion shaft. Not good news. Couple of small areas where the case hardening is starting to go. Ron is sourcing a new one. I have the house mortgage papers out!!!! And will put in a new friction plate at the same time. Everywhere I look only sells the full kit. Does anyone have any idea where I might source a friction plate locally. Tried Tooleys, Just Kampers, Stokers so far. Not even GoWesty have just the plate.

Peter from Port Mac.

20

Peter,

Try John Goodison at Volks Home in Thomastown , Victoria .  John is probably the most reliable source of good quality parts.  He is very fussy about quality and simply refuses to stock anything that he is not happy with or unsure of. 

He is VW from way back and has exceptionally good knowledge of VW parts and sourcing.  (He is also the technical officer for the VW Club of Victoria , an invaluable asset to the club.)

Les

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: 18 November 2014 12:45
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Clutch Friction Plate

Hi to all the experts out there. Gearbox is out for a refurb by Ron in Kempsey. It was looking great until we checked the pinion shaft. Not good news. Couple of small areas where the case hardening is starting to go. Ron is sourcing a new one. I have the house mortgage papers out!!!! And will put in a new friction plate at the same time. Everywhere I look only sells the full kit. Does anyone have any idea where I might source a friction plate locally. Tried Tooleys, Just Kampers, Stokers so far. Not even GoWesty have just the plate.

Peter from Port Mac.