There is a set of new/old stock rotors on ebay i am interested in. The description indicates 2wd and syncro are different rotors. Are they different? thanks Bill.
«There is a set of new/old stock rotors on ebay i am interested in. The description indicates 2wd and syncro are different rotors. Are they different? thanks Bill.»
Bill,
The 2wd disc rotors are made as a single casting with the hub. The Syncro rotor has a separate hub. They are not interchangeable.
Only in the later South African T3 Caravelle models did VW started building 2wd's with separate hub/rotor. However, those are vented 276mm vs. solid 256mm found on your older Syncro. These SA parts are what was later sold as the "SA big brakes" by aftermarket dealers.
Hope that answers your question.
BenT
Sent via BenTberry by BenTNT
Bill,
The 2wd disc rotors are made as a single casting with the hub. The Syncro rotor has a separate hub. They are not interchangeable.
Only in the later South African T3 Caravelle models did VW started building 2wd's with separate hub/rotor. However, those are vented 276mm vs. solid 256mm found on your older Syncro. These SA parts are what was later sold as the "SA big brakes" by aftermarket dealers.
Hope that answers your question.
BenT
Sent via BenTberry by BenTNT
Dear Ben,
Can I also tap your knowledge. I have a RHD German/Austrian Aug '92 build NON 16' Syncro but with genuine 16" VW Syncro wheels.(Still with me and yes they are stronger but heavier). From what you say below could I upgrade to 276mm vented "SA Big Brakes" simply by fitting the SA rotors on my hubs or would other components eg callipers be needed.
Thanks
Roger
--- On Tue, 14/4/09, syncro@gmail.com <syncro@gmail.com> wrote:
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The calipers are ATE FN60 if i remember right, and they can also be
found on some Ford models... I think Ford Escort XR3i up to 1998. Some
other manufacturers are said to have used the same system aswell. The
only thing you REALLY need from SA, is the bracket to actually hold
the caliper. That is a special part only found in SA. If you have a
syncro, you don't need the hubs, you can just fit the discs. On a 2WD
you need special hubs, though these might be manufactured from old
vanagon dics, as practices with other brake upgrades - see attachment.
found on some Ford models... I think Ford Escort XR3i up to 1998. Some
other manufacturers are said to have used the same system aswell. The
only thing you REALLY need from SA, is the bracket to actually hold
the caliper. That is a special part only found in SA. If you have a
syncro, you don't need the hubs, you can just fit the discs. On a 2WD
you need special hubs, though these might be manufactured from old
vanagon dics, as practices with other brake upgrades - see attachment.
« I have a RHD German/Austrian Aug '92 build NON 16' Syncro but with genuine 16" VW Syncro wheels.(Still with me and yes they are stronger but heavier). From what you say below could I upgrade to 276mm vented "SA Big Brakes" simply by fitting the SA rotors on my hubs or would other components eg callipers be needed.»
Hello Roger,
You will also need the calipers. The SA caliper has a slightly extended caliper carrier so it can handle the larger disc. Essentially, the caliper has to sit about half an inch further from the center. There is also a second problem. The thicker, vented SA rotor will not fit the key way of the non-SA Syncro calipers.
Bottomline is you need rotors and calipers at the very minimum.
I don't know if you are familiar with the Audi-dual pistion calipers used on the 100/200/5000 cars. Those can be modified to fit our Syncros and are superior to the SA big brakes in clamping force. There is also a later model Audi, A6 if I am not mistaken, which has a 288mm rotor and matching single-piston caliper which can bolt-on to a Syncro without any machine work. They are very similar to the SA brakes but have the slightly larger discs plus wider brake pads. There is also the bonus that you can get replacement parts from any purveyor of Audi parts. No need to go hunting down a South African T3 parts specialist.
BenT
Sent via BenTberry by BenTNT
Hello Roger,
You will also need the calipers. The SA caliper has a slightly extended caliper carrier so it can handle the larger disc. Essentially, the caliper has to sit about half an inch further from the center. There is also a second problem. The thicker, vented SA rotor will not fit the key way of the non-SA Syncro calipers.
Bottomline is you need rotors and calipers at the very minimum.
I don't know if you are familiar with the Audi-dual pistion calipers used on the 100/200/5000 cars. Those can be modified to fit our Syncros and are superior to the SA big brakes in clamping force. There is also a later model Audi, A6 if I am not mistaken, which has a 288mm rotor and matching single-piston caliper which can bolt-on to a Syncro without any machine work. They are very similar to the SA brakes but have the slightly larger discs plus wider brake pads. There is also the bonus that you can get replacement parts from any purveyor of Audi parts. No need to go hunting down a South African T3 parts specialist.
BenT
Sent via BenTberry by BenTNT
Ben. That answer the question. Thanks very much.I'll look at the photo on ebay and see if it becomes clear. Cheers Bill.
On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 2:27 PM, muddy3267 <marg_bill@westnet.com.au> wrote:
Ben. That answer the question. Thanks very much.I'll look at the photo on ebay and see if it becomes clear. Cheers Bill.
Hello Bill,See attached pics. The first one is a 2wd rotor. The second pic is what a Syncro rotor would look like. Note that there is no integral hub in the Syncro version. This last photo is actually of a vented rotor fom an Audi but it looks close to the Syncro type. In fact this is the type used in conversion kits.BenT
Whoops I forgot the other photo. I am now adding another pic snagged from Ebay which shows the 2wd rotor better.
BenT
On Wed, Apr 15, 2009 at 2:22 AM, BenT Syncro <syncro@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 2:27 PM, muddy3267 <marg_bill@westnet.com.au> wrote:
Ben. That answer the question. Thanks very much.I'll look at the photo on ebay and see if it becomes clear. Cheers Bill.
Hello Bill,See attached pics. The first one is a 2wd rotor. The second pic is what a Syncro rotor would look like. Note that there is no integral hub in the Syncro version. This last photo is actually of a vented rotor fom an Audi but it looks close to the Syncro type. In fact this is the type used in conversion kits.BenT
--
BenT
-- Hi Ben Thanks for posting the pics of the 2wd/4wd rotors. Unfortunately my computer could not open them. Anyway your description wasc sufficient to solve my problem. Thanks again Bill.
Bill,
Ben's pics were attached to his message and I would
expect them to appear in the message as it does on my
computer/email.
Your email server/programme might be set to block
attachments. I have set the Syncro_T3_Australia website to allow
attachments to members' messages, so what ever is happening is downstream of the
website.
As a test, I will forward Ben's emails direct to
your personal email address. Let me know what happens.
Les
----- Original Message -----From: muddy3267Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 6:24 PMSubject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Disc rotors 2wd /syncro Same or different?-- Hi Ben Thanks for posting the pics of the 2wd/4wd rotors. Unfortunately my computer could not open them. Anyway your description wasc sufficient to solve my problem. Thanks again Bill.
Evening Les. The attachments came through no probs on my email site. Thanks Les
--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, syncro@... wrote:
>
> «There is a set of new/old stock rotors on ebay i am interested in. The description indicates 2wd and syncro are different rotors. Are they different? thanks Bill.»
>
> Bill,
>
> The 2wd disc rotors are made as a single casting with the hub. The Syncro rotor has a separate hub. They are not interchangeable.
>
> Only in the later South African T3 Caravelle models did VW started building 2wd's with separate hub/rotor. However, those are vented 276mm vs. solid 256mm found on your older Syncro. These SA parts are what was later sold as the "SA big brakes" by aftermarket dealers.
>
> Hope that answers your question.
>
>
> BenT
> Sent via BenTberry by BenTNT
> Ben. The rotors on ebay are solid with no moulded hub but are 258mm not 256mm you mentioned. Bentley's only makes mention of 258mm. Did you mean 258mm ? Bill
On Fri, Apr 17, 2009 at 2:59 AM, muddy3267 <marg_bill@westnet.com.au> wrote:
> Ben. The rotors on ebay are solid with no moulded hub but are 258mm not 256mm you mentioned. Bentley's only makes mention of 258mm. Did you mean 258mm ? Bill
Bill,You have me at a disadvantage. I am in bed w/o a Bentley. =( It's 04:44am here and I am just turning in. IIRC the specs came from a Vanagon List member who took measurements of a rotor which he had on hand. If you think about it, whether 256mm or 258mm that is only a 2mm difference or about the thickness of a few playing cards.Cheers,BenT
On Fri, Apr 17, 2009 at 2:59 AM, muddy3267 <marg_bill@westnet.com.au> wrote:>> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, syncro@... wrote:> >> > «There is a set of new/old stock rotors on ebay i am interested in. The description indicates 2wd and syncro are different rotors. Are they different? thanks Bill.»Perhaps this is more helpful. I only saw two rotors for sale on OZ Ebay. Both of these are from the same Seller. If the photos are accurate:Item# 250406242831 this pair for a SyncroItem# 260392894618 this single is for a 2wdCheers,BenT
Ben. I wasn't being picky at all but murphy's law says 2mm means the bloody thing sometimes dosn't fit. Anyway the two listings you pointed out, the one i'm looking at is the syncro set . Thanks heaps. Bill