Engine will not start.

Hi All,

 

I’m in trouble again. Engine will not start.

Starter motor works ok. Unscrewed the spark plug and can see the spark.

Fuel pump is working - have plenty of pressure.

Test the plugs to the fuel injectors - ok as per  “Pro Training”

Check the injectors terminals - 16-17 ohms as it should be.

However, I think the fuel injector might not be opening up.

I sprayed ENGINE START aerosols directly into the throttle body,

No hint that the engine wants to fire up.

Any suggestion would be much appreciated.

 

Cheers,

Theo

 

Theo

If you can get hold of a known working relay that sits next to the fuel pump relay in the box under the coil and replace yours with it, you would at least eliminate that as being the cause of no start.

I had intermittent cut out whilst driving and then no start. Slightly different to your problem I know. After replacing many components without any success I finally replaced that relay and have had no issues since.

The relay part number is 321 919 505A

Good luck

Regards

Peter Leolkes


>
Hi Theo,

Do you still have LPG gas on this engine?

Cheers,

Skot

On 12/03/2017 5:30 PM, Theo teows@melbpc.org.au [Syncro_T3_Australia] wrote:

Hi All,

I’m in trouble again. Engine will not start.

Starter motor works ok. Unscrewed the spark plug and can see the spark.

Fuel pump is working - have plenty of pressure.

Test the plugs to the fuel injectors - ok as per “Pro Training”

Check the injectors terminals - 16-17 ohms as it should be.

However, I think the fuel injector might not be opening up.

I sprayed ENGINE START aerosols directly into the throttle body,

No hint that the engine wants to fire up.

Any suggestion would be much appreciated.

Cheers,

Theo


--
Best regards, Scott Pitcher SPB Consulting
It really sounds like you have no spark.

If you have fuel at the bleeder valve and it comes out more when the ignition is turned on then you should have enough fuel.

Sounds like a dead hall sender.

If you sprayed in start ya bastard to the intake and no fire then it must be electrical.

Skot

On 12/03/2017 5:30 PM, Theo teows@melbpc.org.au [Syncro_T3_Australia] wrote:

Hi All,

I’m in trouble again. Engine will not start.

Starter motor works ok. Unscrewed the spark plug and can see the spark.

Fuel pump is working - have plenty of pressure.

Test the plugs to the fuel injectors - ok as per “Pro Training”

Check the injectors terminals - 16-17 ohms as it should be.

However, I think the fuel injector might not be opening up.

I sprayed ENGINE START aerosols directly into the throttle body,

No hint that the engine wants to fire up.

Any suggestion would be much appreciated.

Cheers,

Theo


--
Best regards, Scott Pitcher SPB Consulting
Hi Theo

Just a suggestion,  i had similar problem thought it was the distributor as upon taking that apart the hall sender was broken but it was still making some contact, as it  was another problem found. And that was only a random look to see and not a thorough testing of anything else.

Had greg involved and he finally found culprit which was the coolant temp sensor plug the contacts for the plug and sensor were making brief contact every so often and it was a very poor contact.

So cleaning the contacts of plug and sensor she fired right up.
I have since ordered a new plug not sensor and and installed and no problems again, so there is some credit to start checking contacts that are exposed to the elements and other fluids.

 I even installed a new distributor but the hall sender needed replacing anyway as it was not far from crumbling away.
Hope you find the problem it can be frustrating.cheers 

mark 16'' Double cab


I have had both the T2 coolant sensor and the Hall sender fail (separately) and both resulted in a no start situation. BTW, the T4 Hall sender is a direct replacement for the T3 - no modification required and probably later technology.

Les


----- Original Message -----
From:
Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com

To:
<Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com>
Cc:

Sent:
12 Mar 2017 21:00:42 +0000
Subject:
[Syncro T3 Australia] Re: Engine will not start.


Hi Theo


Just a suggestion, i had similar problem thought it was the distributor as upon taking that apart the hall sender was broken but it was still making some contact, as it was another problem found. And that was only a random look to see and not a thorough testing of anything else.

Had greg involved and he finally found culprit which was the coolant temp sensor plug the contacts for the plug and sensor were making brief contact every so often and it was a very poor contact.

So cleaning the contacts of plug and sensor she fired right up.
I have since ordered a new plug not sensor and and installed and no problems again, so there is some credit to start checking contacts that are exposed to the elements and other fluids.

I even installed a new distributor but the hall sender needed replacing anyway as it was not far from crumbling away.
Hope you find the problem it can be frustrating.cheers

mark 16'' Double cab



Email sent using Optus Webmail

Thank you for all your contributions so far.

I did unscrew one spark plug and I can see the spark when cranking the engine.

So, I have a spark right?

 

I will check on the other items suggested.

Have to do my stretching exercise first.

I’m still on LPG as well.  However I let the tank run empty - so I can’t check if the engine would start on LPG, silly me.

 

Cheers,

Theo

Had a similar problem ,mine was the AFM

Cheers
Philippe
On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 at 06:52, Theo teows@melbpc.org.au [Syncro_T3_Australia] <Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Thank you for all your contributions so far.

I did unscrew one spark plug and I can see the spark when cranking the engine.

So, I have a spark right?

I will check on the other items suggested.

Have to do my stretching exercise first.

I’m still on LPG as well. However I let the tank run empty - so I can’t check if the engine would start on LPG, silly me.

Cheers,

Theo

--
Regards

Philippe Tyack

Hygizone Australia
Mobile:+61450059162

Hi Theo.  Sorry  I have no knowledge to help, but I hope it is solved soon for you. Cheers.  Jim.

On 13 Mar 2017 09:52, "Theo teows@melbpc.org.au [Syncro_T3_Australia]" <Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Thank you for all your contributions so far.

I did unscrew one spark plug and I can see the spark when cranking the engine.

So, I have a spark right?

 

I will check on the other items suggested.

Have to do my stretching exercise first.

I’m still on LPG as well.  However I let the tank run empty - so I can’t check if the engine would start on LPG, silly me.

 

Cheers,

Theo

Hi Theo,

I could come over one evening and have a look. Not sure I can solve anything, but happy to help and have a few spares that could be used to trouble shoot.

Richard

Richard, you are more than welcome. Maybe the Syncro is upset because I put him down for a major heart transplant.

Theo

 

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, 13 March 2017 4:43 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Engine will not start.

 

 

Hi Theo,

I could come over one evening and have a look. Not sure I can solve anything, but happy to help and have a few spares that could be used to trouble shoot.

Richard

Hi Theo, i had so many problems with symptoms similiar to yours but don't know what stopped me from giving up. The AFM seemed sus to me and as i had replaced about all there is, i opened the AFM and adjusted the track of the runners by what Bosch allowed being approx 1.5 or 2 mm. I ordered a remanufactured unit from van cafe and keep it in the truck with the tools to replace if needed. Having done close to a thousand ks with the readjustment and never experienced any hick ups and very slowly my confidence is building up again. Fingers crossed. You will get there and with Richards help you will moving once again.
Hart

Sent from my iPad

On 13 Mar 2017, at 6:51 PM, Theo teows@melbpc.org.au [Syncro_T3_Australia] <Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 

Richard, you are more than welcome. Maybe the Syncro is upset because I put him down for a major heart transplant.

Theo

 

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, 13 March 2017 4:43 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Engine will not start.

 

 

Hi Theo,

I could come over one evening and have a look. Not sure I can solve anything, but happy to help and have a few spares that could be used to trouble shoot.

Richard

Hi Theo, give me a call 0457 760 455.

Not sure what times are good for you, I probably can't get to your place until ~7:30pm week nights.

Maybe park the syncro's side by side to alleviate the pain of a transplant? I'll check I've got all my bits and pieces together.

Richard



---In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, <teows@...> wrote :

Richard, you are more than welcome. Maybe the Syncro is upset because I put him down for a major heart transplant.

Theo

 

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, 13 March 2017 4:43 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Engine will not start.

 

 

Hi Theo,

I could come over one evening and have a look. Not sure I can solve anything, but happy to help and have a few spares that could be used to trouble shoot.

Richard

I recently had a similar problem with my xf falcon which has bosch fuel injection the problem was found to be in the emc unit which sends a signal to the injector to open and shut replaced the emc started up immediatly.
Bob 



------ Original Message ------
From: "Scott Pitcher spbconsulting@bigpond.com [Syncro_T3_Australia]" <Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com>
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, 12 Mar, 2017 At 10:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Engine will not start.

   
 
     
                   

          Hi Theo,
   
    Do you still have LPG gas on this engine?
   
    Cheers,
   
    Skot
   
   

On 12/03/2017 5:30 PM, Theo       teows@melbpc.org.au [Syncro_T3_Australia] wrote:
   
   
                   
           
             

Hi All,

             

 

             

I’m in trouble again. Engine will not                 start.

             

Starter motor works ok. Unscrewed the                 spark plug and can see the spark.

             

Fuel pump is working - have plenty of                 pressure.

             

Test the plugs to the fuel injectors                 - ok as per  “Pro Training”

             

Check the injectors terminals - 16-17                 ohms as it should be.

             

However, I think the fuel injector                 might not be opening up.

             

I sprayed ENGINE START aerosols                 directly into the throttle body,

             

No hint that the engine wants to fire                 up.

             

Any suggestion would be much                 appreciated.

             

 

             

Cheers,

             

Theo

             

 

           
         
                             
   
   
--
      Best regards,       Scott Pitcher       SPB Consulting
   

     
               
               

Hi Richard and all the other contributors to this issue.

 

I did not know you are a night owl worker - 12am!!

We went through all the items mention on this forum and still no go.

I made up a little gadget with 3 AA batteries as you suggested to check if the fuel injectors are working

I could hear a tiny click, but still no start. Then I removed all the LPG wiring - still no good.

I had a spark so no point to check coil which, by the way, was bought new on the suggestion of a VW mechanic.

However no harm in trying, so I installed my very old spare Bosch coil, and hey presto the engine fired up.

I don’t understand - how can you check a sick coil ??

Thanks again for your help, I owe you one.

Cheers from a more relaxed

Theo

 

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, 13 March 2017 9:54 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Engine will not start.

 

 

Hi Theo, give me a call 0457 760 455.

Not sure what times are good for you, I probably can't get to your place until ~7:30pm week nights.

Maybe park the syncro's side by side to alleviate the pain of a transplant? I'll check I've got all my bits and pieces together.

Richard



---In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, <teows@...> wrote :

Richard, you are more than welcome. Maybe the Syncro is upset because I put him down for a major heart transplant.

Theo

 

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, 13 March 2017 4:43 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Engine will not start.

 

 

Hi Theo,

I could come over one evening and have a look. Not sure I can solve anything, but happy to help and have a few spares that could be used to trouble shoot.

Richard

Well done Theo,

You can get a spark that is weak from a dead coil but it will often not fire an engine and if it does it will be low on power.

The coils were an issue with the T3 with the original green one used till 85 then 96 & 87 changed to a grey coil and VW had a re-call on that as that coil regularly failed and VW went back to the green coil.

You may have been given one of the dodgy grey coils?

Cheers,

Skot

On 15/03/2017 10:43 PM, Theo teows@melbpc.org.au [Syncro_T3_Australia] wrote:

Hi Richard and all the other contributors to this issue.

I did not know you are a night owl worker - 12am!!

We went through all the items mention on this forum and still no go.

I made up a little gadget with 3 AA batteries as you suggested to check if the fuel injectors are working

I could hear a tiny click, but still no start. Then I removed all the LPG wiring - still no good.

I had a spark so no point to check coil which, by the way, was bought new on the suggestion of a VW mechanic.

However no harm in trying, so I installed my very old spare Bosch coil, and hey presto the engine fired up.

I don’t understand - how can you check a sick coil ??

Thanks again for your help, I owe you one.

Cheers from a more relaxed

Theo

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, 13 March 2017 9:54 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Engine will not start.

Hi Theo, give me a call 0457 760 455.

Not sure what times are good for you, I probably can't get to your place until ~7:30pm week nights.

Maybe park the syncro's side by side to alleviate the pain of a transplant? I'll check I've got all my bits and pieces together.

Richard



---In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, <teows@...> wrote :

Richard, you are more than welcome. Maybe the Syncro is upset because I put him down for a major heart transplant.

Theo

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, 13 March 2017 4:43 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Engine will not start.

Hi Theo,

I could come over one evening and have a look. Not sure I can solve anything, but happy to help and have a few spares that could be used to trouble shoot.

Richard


--
Best regards, Scott Pitcher SPB Consulting

Wow, glad you got it working Theo. It certainly had a nice bright spark at the plug, not what I would consider weak, so surprised that is what it was.

Yes you can check a coil looking for resistance in the primary and secondary windings. Will have to look up figures to check against. Coils can sometimes have issues as they heat up, but given yours was not running, this is not an issue :)

I was happy to help Theo, even though it did not start up, all good experience!

Richard



---In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, <teows@...> wrote :

Hi Richard and all the other contributors to this issue.

 

I did not know you are a night owl worker - 12am!!

We went through all the items mention on this forum and still no go.

I made up a little gadget with 3 AA batteries as you suggested to check if the fuel injectors are working

I could hear a tiny click, but still no start. Then I removed all the LPG wiring - still no good.

I had a spark  so no point to check coil which, by the way, was bought new on the suggestion of a VW mechanic.

However no harm in trying, so I installed my very old spare Bosch coil, and hey presto the engine fired up.  

I don’t understand - how can you check a sick coil ??

Thanks again for your help, I owe you one.

Cheers from a more relaxed

Theo

 

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, 13 March 2017 9:54 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Engine will not start.

 

 

Hi Theo, give me a call 0457 760 455.

Not sure what times are good for you, I probably can't get to your place until ~7:30pm week nights.

Maybe park the syncro's side by side to alleviate the pain of a transplant? I'll check I've got all my bits and pieces together.

Richard



---In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, <teows@...> wrote :

Richard, you are more than welcome. Maybe the Syncro is upset because I put him down for a major heart transplant.

Theo

 

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, 13 March 2017 4:43 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Engine will not start.

 

 

Hi Theo,

I could come over one evening and have a look. Not sure I can solve anything, but happy to help and have a few spares that could be used to trouble shoot.

Richard

Hi Skot,

I don’t know about the green / grey coil issue. Mine old one looks black - part # 211 805 115D Bosch brand.

The new one I bought 3 month ago is after market, could not buy the genuine version.

Cheers,

Theo

 

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Thursday, 16 March 2017 1:54 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Engine will not start.

 

 

Well done Theo,

You can get a spark that is weak from a dead coil but it will often not fire an engine and if it does it will be low on power.

The coils were an issue with the T3 with the original green one used till 85 then 96 & 87 changed to a grey coil and VW had a re-call on that as that coil regularly failed and VW went back to the green coil.

You may have been given one of the dodgy grey coils?

Cheers,

Skot

On 15/03/2017 10:43 PM, Theo teows@melbpc.org.au [Syncro_T3_Australia] wrote:

 

Hi Richard and all the other contributors to this issue.

 

I did not know you are a night owl worker - 12am!!

We went through all the items mention on this forum and still no go.

I made up a little gadget with 3 AA batteries as you suggested to check if the fuel injectors are working

I could hear a tiny click, but still no start. Then I removed all the LPG wiring - still no good.

I had a spark  so no point to check coil which, by the way, was bought new on the suggestion of a VW mechanic.

However no harm in trying, so I installed my very old spare Bosch coil, and hey presto the engine fired up.  

I don’t understand - how can you check a sick coil ??

Thanks again for your help, I owe you one.

Cheers from a more relaxed

Theo

 

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, 13 March 2017 9:54 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Engine will not start.

 

 

Hi Theo, give me a call 0457 760 455.

Not sure what times are good for you, I probably can't get to your place until ~7:30pm week nights.

Maybe park the syncro's side by side to alleviate the pain of a transplant? I'll check I've got all my bits and pieces together.

Richard



---In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, <teows@...> wrote :

Richard, you are more than welcome. Maybe the Syncro is upset because I put him down for a major heart transplant.

Theo

 

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, 13 March 2017 4:43 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Engine will not start.

 

 

Hi Theo,

I could come over one evening and have a look. Not sure I can solve anything, but happy to help and have a few spares that could be used to trouble shoot.

Richard

 

--
Best regards, Scott Pitcher SPB Consulting

Here's a message I put together last year, when I was having intermittent problems with my coil. If anyone can find a source of genuine Bosch coils, please let me know ...

Digifant Ignition Coil, spark plug lead and rotor testing

There are a number of on-the-car, shade-tree tests for your ignition coil, but to definitively determine whether your coil is on the way out, the only proper coil test is with a multimeter. Why? Here's the rundown:

Inside an ignition coil are two coils of wire on top of each other. These coils are called windings. One winding is called the primary winding, the other is the secondary. The primary winding gets the juice together to make a spark and the secondary sends it out the door to the distributor. Either one of these windings can go bad and cause your ignition coil to fail.

Sometimes an ignition coil is bad, clearly bad, as in it makes no spark at all. But if a coil is on the way out, but not dead yet, it can make a weak spark that can cause the car to run rough or wrong. By testing an ignition coil with a multimeter while it's disconnected, you'll be using data and numbers to determine the health of the coil rather than your eyeballs and dead reckoning.

We'll show you how to test both the primary and secondary ignition coil windings using a multimeter.

*You'll need the resistance specifications for your specific coil in order to perform this test. Consult your service manual for this information. The figures given below are for the standard VW coil, PN 211 905 115 D.

The primary winding of your ignition coil is the first to receive voltage from the battery. Find the resistance specifications for your car's primary coil winding in your repair manual. Then using a multimeter, place the leads on the smaller, outside poles if you have a traditional round coil, or on the indicated poles if you have a newer enclosed unit. If the reading is within the range indicated in your manual, your primary winding is ok and you can go on to the secondary test. If it is even a little out of spec, the coil should be replaced.

The secondary winding of your ignition coil delivers the spark to the distributor to be sent to the spark plugs. If it's bad, you'll get a weak spark or no spark at all.

To test the coil's secondary winding, attach the test probes to the outer 12V pole and the centre pole (where the main wire goes to the distributor). Determine the resistance and check to see if it's within the range indicated in your repair manual. If it is, your coil is up to the task. If it's even slightly out of range, your coil should be replaced.

VW T3 coil;

If an ignition coil fails completely, it will make no spark at all. But if it is performing below par, it can make a weak spark that can cause the van to run badly.

I once tested three used VW coils in search of a good one. All would make the engine run, but none of them were up to spec. The purchase of a new coil made a noticeable difference.

The primary winding of the ignition coil is the first to receive voltage from the battery when the ignition switch is turned on, via terminal 15 (+).

Using a multimeter, place the probes on the small outside wires (terminals 15(+) and 1(-). If the primary resistance between the two is 0.5 to 0.8Ω, the primary winding is ok and you can go on to the secondary test. If it is out of spec, replace the coil with the spare that you always carry under the seat.

The secondary winding of the ignition coil delivers the spark to the distributor to be sent to the spark plugs. If it's bad, you'll get a weak spark or no spark at all.

To test the secondary winding, attach test probes to terminal 15+ and the centre pole (where the thick wire goes to the distributor). The resistance should be 2.4 to 3.5 kΩ. If it is out of range, toss the coil.

If ignition coil is overheating and breaking down, causing misfiring and lack of power, test the ignition switching function of the control unit (the black box under the rear seat, otherwise known as the ECU).

Connect the multimeter probes to terminals 15 (+) and 1 (-) on the ignition coil.

Disconnect Hall Sender plug on distributor.

Have an assistant switch the ignition ON.

Ground the centre wire of hall sender plug for approximately 3 seconds. The displayed voltage must increase briefly to approximately 4.5 volts.

If not, replace control unit. (See Bentley manual 28.44).

(My ECU failed this test – the symptoms were misfiring and backfiring after driving for over 45 minutes. It was more noticeable when travelling uphill at highway speeds. The coil was too hot to hold. I replaced the ECU and it solved the problem.)

Engine earths; clean the connections on the braided wire between the engine and the bodywork with emery paper and a wire brush. According to an NRMA survey, poor earths are the most common cause of engine breakdowns. Also check that the earth connection on the battery is clean.

Check all electrical connections, check wires for cracked or melted insulation or broken wires or connections which can cause an intermittent problem. The fragile connector on the hall sender is often damaged.

Check relays and connections in the engine compartment. Always carry spare relays and replace if in doubt.

Ignition leads; test leads for continuity and damage.

Suppressor plug lead to distributor cap connectors 0.6 to 1.4 kΩ

Spark plug connectors 4 to 6 kΩ. Check that they are dry and undamaged and tightly connected to the ignition leads.

Rotor 0.6-1.4 kΩ. Check for damage. Always carry a spare and replace if in doubt.

Distributor cap; check for cracks and carbon tracking, and inspect the spring-loaded graphite centre-post as it may wear or break. Always carry a spare and replace if in doubt.

Spark Plugs; Check that the correct spark plugs are fitted, and inspect the condition of the ceramic insulator, the integrity of the electrodes, and the spark plug gaps.

It is best to check all of these items in the comfort of your shed at least once a year (or before any major expedition) along with changing oils, fluids and filters, checking all the sensors and adjustments as per the Bentley manual, and lubricating everything that moves.

It is fun and educational to remove the engine lid and run the engine on a dark night. Stray sparks, luminescence and lightning bolts can be very illuminating.

If an ignition coil fails completely, it will make no spark at all. But if it is performing below par, it can make a weak spark that can cause the van to run badly.

Symptoms can include partial loss of power, erratic idle, stumble and miss on acceleration from low revs, flat spots, missing under load, and cutting out. Symptoms may only present themselves (or get worse) as the engine heats up (and the coil is too hot to touch). If the engine stops, or fails to start when hot, it may restart after the coil has cooled down.

Although a coil passes all tests with the ohm-meter it can still deteriorate when hot, due to degradation of internal insulation.

If planning a desert expedition, fit a new coil and carry the old one for a spare.

Problems with a weak coil will be exacerbated by poor maintenance of other ignition components such as faulty or incorrect spark plugs, excessive spark plug gaps, faulty plug leads or connectors, or loose or dirty electrical connections. Broken wires are not always obvious, causing intermittent faults. Old and cracked distributor caps and rotor buttons, and poor earth connections from the engine to the bodywork can be problematic. A combination of any or all of theses conditions can contribute to the early demise of a coil.

I once tested three used VW coils in search of a good one. All would make the engine run, but none of them were up to spec. The purchase of a new coil made a noticeable difference.

The primary winding of the ignition coil is the first to receive voltage from the battery when the ignition switch is turned on, via terminal 15 (+).

Using a multimeter, place the probes on the small outside wires (terminals 15(+) and 1(-). If the primary resistance between the two is 0.5 to 0.8Ω, the primary winding is ok and you can go on to the secondary test. If it is out of spec, replace the coil with the spare that you always carry under the seat.

The secondary winding of the ignition coil delivers the spark to the distributor to be sent to the spark plugs. If it's bad, you'll get a weak spark or no spark at all.

To test the secondary winding, attach test probes to terminal 15+ and the centre pole (where the thick wire goes to the distributor). The resistance should be 2.4 to 3.5 kΩ. If it is out of range, toss the coil.

If ignition coil is overheating and breaking down, causing misfiring and lack of power, test the ignition switching function of the control unit (the black box under the rear seat, otherwise known as the ECU).

To test the ECU; (See Bentley manual 28.44).

Connect the multimeter probes to terminals 15 (+) and 1 (-) on the ignition coil.

Disconnect Hall Sender plug on distributor.

Have an assistant switch the ignition ON.

Ground the centre wire of hall sender plug for approximately 3 seconds. The displayed voltage must increase briefly to approximately 4.5 volts.

If not, replace control unit.

(My ECU failed this test – the symptoms were misfiring and backfiring after driving for over 45 minutes. It was more noticeable when travelling uphill at highway speeds. The coil was too hot to hold. I replaced the ECU and it solved the problem.)

Other things to check;

Engine earths; clean the connections on the braided wire between the engine and the bodywork with emery paper and a wire brush. According to an NRMA survey, poor earths are the most common cause of engine breakdowns. Also check that the earth connection on the battery is clean. I generally add another earth wire to the cylinder head on the driver’s side, as it lacks a good track to earth due to the fact it is insulated by gaskets and sealant from the rest of the engine.

Check all electrical connections, check wires for cracked or melted insulation, broken wires or connections which can cause an intermittent problem. The fragile connector on the hall sender is often damaged.

Check relays and connections in the engine compartment. Always carry spare relays and replace if in doubt.

Ignition leads; test leads for continuity and damage.

Suppressor plug lead to distributor cap connectors; 0.6 to 1.4 kΩ

Spark plug connectors; 4 to 6 kΩ. Check that they are dry and undamaged and tightly connected to the ignition leads.

Rotor; 0.6-1.4 kΩ. Check for damage. Always carry a spare and replace if in doubt.

Distributor cap; check for cracks and carbon tracking, and inspect the spring-loaded graphite centre-post as it may wear or break. Always carry a spare and replace if in doubt.

Spark Plugs; Check that the correct spark plugs are fitted, and inspect the condition of the ceramic insulator, the integrity of the electrodes, and the spark plug gaps. Bosch W7CC or Beru 14-7-CU are recommended.

It is best to check all of these items in the comfort of your shed at least once a year (or before an expedition) along with changing oils, fluids and filters, checking all the sensors and adjustments as per the Bentley manual, and lubricating everything that moves.

It is educational to remove the engine lid and run the engine on a dark night. Stray sparks, luminescence and lightning bolts can be very illuminating.

Searching for a substitute coil;

A canister coil for suppressed electronic ignition systems is used. It is not the same as that used on the VW air-cooled engines with points ignition. It has a female king-post with a male prong for 6mm high-tension lead to the distributor. (Some non-genuine coils will accept a 7mm HT lead. The metal ‘wings’ on the HT end-plug needs to be bent outward slightly for a good fit).

The original coil was manufactured by Bosch and carried VW part number 211 905 115D, and carried a green label. They were fitted to all VW DJ & MV transporters from 1984-92. Versions of this coil are still readily available from around $35 - $50[i] from most VW parts suppliers. (Some early models had the 211 905 115 B coil with .52Ω to .76Ω primary and 2.4Ω to 3.5Ω secondary resistance)

The Bosch p/n was 0221 122 350, (now discontinued and replaced with 0221 122 349). I priced one of the latter at Autobarn for $160.[ii] Discussion on other websites indicates that Bosch components are rarely made in Germany nowadays. The quality of the Spanish and Mexican units are not as good as the German, but far superior to the cheap Chinese clones. Google “bosch ignition coil 0221 122 349.” I found them on Ebay for $106 to $120 in July 2016.

If searching for parts from a wrecking yard, check out VW Golf, Passat, Polo and Jetta models of similar vintage. They can also be found on various Audi 80/90/100, BMW 316, 318 & 525, Saab 900, Holden Calibra, and Volvo 240, 740, 760 & 940 models in the same era.

Some engines (primarily imports with DF, DG, SP and DJ prefix) were fitted with a coil with a grey label – 191 905 115 A/B/C with .6Ω to .8Ω primary and 6.9Ω to 8.5Ω secondary resistance)

Other brands claim to be an identical replacement;[iii]

Fuel Miser CC501 ($46 - 110)[iv] commonly available in Australian stores.

RAE C285 commonly available in Australian stores.

Beru ZS123 or ZS 124 (both listed for all VW T3 1.9 & 2.1 1984-91).

NGK U180 48343

IGC 137 (around $100[v])

Topran 103 240 (sold through some outlets as 211 905 115D) $49[vi]

I have tried the Topran, and it let me down on the first trip – luckily I still had the original under the seat!

A search of the internet reveals other alternatives; Automega, Bremi (11906 & 11822), BBT (ICO 3105), Beru (0040100124), Bougicord (155084), Facet (96206), Era (880030), JP (905210001), Mapco, Pex, Quinton Hazell, Standard, Vemo (V10700072 & V10700052), and several Chinese manufacturers – Frey, Microne, Hongsheng and Jitai.



[i] JK $35 May 2016.

[ii] May 2016. Also available on the usual US, UK and Euro websites.

[iii] Please double-check before ordering.

[iv] Repco $46, Auto One $110, May 2016

[v] eBay

[vi] VWHeritage Australia May 2016. (I fitted one in April, it failed on the first long trip).

Thank you for this very detailed test procedure Roger. Very useful.
I am sure i have read it before but is is good to be reminded.
I have tried to take your advice of 
"Check relays and connections in the engine compartment. Always carry spare relays and replace if in doubt."
However I have had difficulty in sourcing one of the relays in the engine compartment.
The one with part number is 321 919 505A which sits next to the fuel pump relay. I think it is the ECU relay.
Does anyone know of a source locally or overseas? Preferably local.
I purchased and installed a new Bosch coil in Dec '15 and have had no problems.Ignition Coil 211 905 115 D (VW OEM)  0 221 122 349 (Bosch)
From HSY here in Adelaide.  $175. Clearly paid too much but was very convenient.
Thanks again
Regards
Peter



On 17/03/2017, at 5:25 PM, Roger Bayley gullyraker53@gmail.com [Syncro_T3_Australia] wrote:

 

Here's a message I put together last year, when I was having intermittent problems with my coil. If anyone can find a source of genuine Bosch coils, please let me know ...

Digifant Ignition Coil, spark plug lead and rotor testing

 There are a number of on-the-car, shade-tree tests for your ignition coil, but to definitively determine whether your coil is on the way out, the only proper coil test is with a multimeter. Why? Here's the rundown:

  Inside an ignition coil are two coils of wire on top of each other. These coils are called windings. One winding is called the primary winding, the other is the secondary. The primary winding gets the juice together to make a spark and the secondary sends it out the door to the distributor. Either one of these windings can go bad and cause your ignition coil to fail.

  Sometimes an ignition coil is bad, clearly bad, as in it makes no spark at all. But if a coil is on the way out, but not dead yet, it can make a weak spark that can cause the car to run rough or wrong. By testing an ignition coil with a multimeter while it's disconnected, you'll be using data and numbers to determine the health of the coil rather than your eyeballs and dead reckoning.

We'll show you how to test both the primary and secondary ignition coil windings using a multimeter.

*You'll need the resistance specifications for your specific coil in order to perform this test. Consult your service manual for this information. The figures given below are for the standard VW coil, PN 211 905 115 D.

The primary winding of your ignition coil is the first to receive voltage from the battery. Find the resistance specifications for your car's primary coil winding in your repair manual. Then using a multimeter, place the leads on the smaller, outside poles if you have a traditional round coil, or on the indicated poles if you have a newer enclosed unit. If the reading is within the range indicated in your manual, your primary winding is ok and you can go on to the secondary test. If it is even a little out of spec, the coil should be replaced.

The secondary winding of your ignition coil delivers the spark to the distributor to be sent to the spark plugs. If it's bad, you'll get a weak spark or no spark at all.

To test the coil's secondary winding, attach the test probes to the outer 12V pole and the centre pole (where the main wire goes to the distributor). Determine the resistance and check to see if it's within the range indicated in your repair manual. If it is, your coil is up to the task. If it's even slightly out of range, your coil should be replaced.

VW T3 coil;

If an ignition coil fails completely, it will make no spark at all. But if it is performing below par, it can make a weak spark that can cause the van to run badly.

I once tested three used VW coils in search of a good one. All would make the engine run, but none of them were up to spec. The purchase of a new coil made a noticeable difference.

 The primary winding of the ignition coil is the first to receive voltage from the battery when the ignition switch is turned on, via terminal 15 (+).

Using a multimeter, place the probes on the small outside wires (terminals 15(+) and 1(-). If the primary resistance between the two is 0.5 to 0.8Ω, the primary winding is ok and you can go on to the secondary test. If it is out of spec, replace the coil with the spare that you always carry under the seat.

The secondary winding of the ignition coil delivers the spark to the distributor to be sent to the spark plugs. If it's bad, you'll get a weak spark or no spark at all.

To test the secondary winding, attach test probes to terminal 15+ and the centre pole (where the thick wire goes to the distributor). The resistance should be 2.4 to 3.5 kΩ. If it is out of range, toss the coil.

 If ignition coil is overheating and breaking down, causing misfiring and lack of power, test the ignition switching function of the control unit (the black box under the rear seat, otherwise known as the ECU).

Connect the multimeter probes to terminals 15 (+) and 1 (-) on the ignition coil.

Disconnect Hall Sender plug on distributor.

Have an assistant switch the ignition ON.

Ground the centre wire of hall sender plug for approximately 3 seconds. The displayed voltage must increase briefly to approximately 4.5 volts.

If not, replace control unit. (See Bentley manual 28.44).

(My ECU failed this test – the symptoms were misfiring and backfiring after driving for over 45 minutes. It was more noticeable when travelling uphill at highway speeds. The coil was too hot to hold. I replaced the ECU and it solved the problem.)

Engine earths; clean the connections on the braided wire between the engine and the bodywork with emery paper and a wire brush. According to an NRMA survey, poor earths are the most common cause of engine breakdowns. Also check that the earth connection on the battery is clean.

Check all electrical connections, check wires for cracked or melted insulation or broken wires or connections which can cause an intermittent problem. The fragile connector on the hall sender is often damaged.

Check relays and connections in the engine compartment. Always carry spare relays and replace if in doubt.

Ignition leads; test leads for continuity and damage.

Suppressor plug lead to distributor cap connectors 0.6 to 1.4 kΩ

Spark plug connectors 4 to 6 kΩ. Check that they are dry and undamaged and tightly connected to the ignition leads.

Rotor 0.6-1.4 kΩ. Check for damage. Always carry a spare and replace if in doubt.

Distributor cap; check for cracks and carbon tracking, and inspect the spring-loaded graphite centre-post as it may wear or break. Always carry a spare and replace if in doubt.

Spark Plugs; Check that the correct spark plugs are fitted, and inspect the condition of the ceramic insulator, the integrity of the electrodes, and the spark plug gaps.

It is best to check all of these items in the comfort of your shed at least once a year (or before any major expedition) along with changing oils, fluids and filters, checking all the sensors and adjustments as per the Bentley manual, and lubricating everything that moves.

It is fun and educational to remove the engine lid and run the engine on a dark night. Stray sparks, luminescence and lightning bolts can be very illuminating.

If an ignition coil fails completely, it will make no spark at all. But if it is performing below par, it can make a weak spark that can cause the van to run badly.

Symptoms can include partial loss of power, erratic idle, stumble and miss on acceleration from low revs, flat spots, missing under load, and cutting out. Symptoms may only present themselves (or get worse) as the engine heats up (and the coil is too hot to touch). If the engine stops, or fails to start when hot, it may restart after the coil has cooled down.

Although a coil passes all tests with the ohm-meter it can still deteriorate when hot, due to degradation of internal insulation.

If planning a desert expedition, fit a new coil and carry the old one for a spare.

Problems with a weak coil will be exacerbated by poor maintenance of other ignition components such as faulty or incorrect spark plugs, excessive spark plug gaps, faulty plug leads or connectors, or loose or dirty electrical connections. Broken wires are not always obvious, causing intermittent faults. Old and cracked distributor caps and rotor buttons, and poor earth connections from the engine to the bodywork can be problematic. A combination of any or all of theses conditions can contribute to the early demise of a coil.

I once tested three used VW coils in search of a good one. All would make the engine run, but none of them were up to spec. The purchase of a new coil made a noticeable difference.

 The primary winding of the ignition coil is the first to receive voltage from the battery when the ignition switch is turned on, via terminal 15 (+).

Using a multimeter, place the probes on the small outside wires (terminals 15(+) and 1(-). If the primary resistance between the two is 0.5 to 0.8Ω, the primary winding is ok and you can go on to the secondary test. If it is out of spec, replace the coil with the spare that you always carry under the seat.

The secondary winding of the ignition coil delivers the spark to the distributor to be sent to the spark plugs. If it's bad, you'll get a weak spark or no spark at all.

To test the secondary winding, attach test probes to terminal 15+ and the centre pole (where the thick wire goes to the distributor). The resistance should be 2.4 to 3.5 kΩ. If it is out of range, toss the coil.

 If ignition coil is overheating and breaking down, causing misfiring and lack of power, test the ignition switching function of the control unit (the black box under the rear seat, otherwise known as the ECU).

To test the ECU; (See Bentley manual 28.44).

Connect the multimeter probes to terminals 15 (+) and 1 (-) on the ignition coil.

Disconnect Hall Sender plug on distributor.

Have an assistant switch the ignition ON.

Ground the centre wire of hall sender plug for approximately 3 seconds. The displayed voltage must increase briefly to approximately 4.5 volts.

If not, replace control unit.

(My ECU failed this test – the symptoms were misfiring and backfiring after driving for over 45 minutes. It was more noticeable when travelling uphill at highway speeds. The coil was too hot to hold. I replaced the ECU and it solved the problem.)

Other things to check;

Engine earths; clean the connections on the braided wire between the engine and the bodywork with emery paper and a wire brush. According to an NRMA survey, poor earths are the most common cause of engine breakdowns. Also check that the earth connection on the battery is clean. I generally add another earth wire to the cylinder head on the driver’s side, as it lacks a good track to earth due to the fact it is insulated by gaskets and sealant from the rest of the engine.

Check all electrical connections, check wires for cracked or melted insulation, broken wires or connections which can cause an intermittent problem. The fragile connector on the hall sender is often damaged.

Check relays and connections in the engine compartment. Always carry spare relays and replace if in doubt.

Ignition leads; test leads for continuity and damage.

Suppressor plug lead to distributor cap connectors; 0.6 to 1.4 kΩ

Spark plug connectors; 4 to 6 kΩ. Check that they are dry and undamaged and tightly connected to the ignition leads.

Rotor; 0.6-1.4 kΩ. Check for damage. Always carry a spare and replace if in doubt.

Distributor cap; check for cracks and carbon tracking, and inspect the spring-loaded graphite centre-post as it may wear or break. Always carry a spare and replace if in doubt.

Spark Plugs; Check that the correct spark plugs are fitted, and inspect the condition of the ceramic insulator, the integrity of the electrodes, and the spark plug gaps. Bosch W7CC or Beru 14-7-CU are recommended.

It is best to check all of these items in the comfort of your shed at least once a year (or before an expedition) along with changing oils, fluids and filters, checking all the sensors and adjustments as per the Bentley manual, and lubricating everything that moves.

It is educational to remove the engine lid and run the engine on a dark night. Stray sparks, luminescence and lightning bolts can be very illuminating.

Searching for a substitute coil;

A canister coil for suppressed electronic ignition systems is used. It is not the same as that used on the VW air-cooled engines with points ignition. It has a female king-post with a male prong for 6mm high-tension lead to the distributor. (Some non-genuine coils will accept a 7mm HT lead. The metal ‘wings’ on the HT end-plug needs to be bent outward slightly for a good fit).

The original coil was manufactured by Bosch and carried VW part number 211 905 115D, and carried a green label. They were fitted to all VW DJ & MV transporters from 1984-92. Versions of this coil are still readily available from around $35 - $50[i] from most VW parts suppliers. (Some early models had the 211 905 115 B coil with .52Ω to .76Ω primary and 2.4Ω to 3.5Ω secondary resistance)

The Bosch p/n was 0221 122 350, (now discontinued and replaced with 0221 122 349). I priced one of the latter at Autobarn for $160.[ii] Discussion on other websites indicates that Bosch components are rarely made in Germany nowadays. The quality of the Spanish and Mexican units are not as good as the German, but far superior to the cheap Chinese clones. Google “bosch ignition coil 0221 122 349.” I found them on Ebay for $106 to $120 in July 2016.

If searching for parts from a wrecking yard, check out VW Golf, Passat, Polo and Jetta models of similar vintage. They can also be found on various Audi 80/90/100, BMW 316, 318 & 525, Saab 900, Holden Calibra, and Volvo 240, 740, 760 & 940 models in the same era.

Some engines (primarily imports with DF, DG, SP and DJ prefix) were fitted with a coil with a grey label – 191 905 115 A/B/C with .6Ω to .8Ω primary and 6.9Ω to 8.5Ω secondary resistance)

Other brands claim to be an identical replacement;[iii]

Fuel Miser CC501 ($46 - 110)[iv] commonly available in Australian stores.

RAE C285 commonly available in Australian stores.

Beru ZS123 or ZS 124 (both listed for all VW T3 1.9 & 2.1 1984-91).

NGK U180 48343

IGC 137 (around $100[v])

Topran 103 240 (sold through some outlets as 211 905 115D) $49[vi]

I have tried the Topran, and it let me down on the first trip – luckily I still had the original under the seat!

A search of the internet reveals other alternatives; Automega, Bremi (11906 & 11822), BBT (ICO 3105), Beru (0040100124), Bougicord (155084), Facet (96206), Era (880030), JP (905210001), Mapco, Pex, Quinton Hazell, Standard, Vemo (V10700072 & V10700052), and several Chinese manufacturers – Frey, Microne, Hongsheng and Jitai.



[i] JK $35 May 2016.

[ii] May 2016. Also available on the usual US, UK and Euro websites.

[iii] Please double-check before ordering.

[iv] Repco $46, Auto One $110, May 2016

[v] eBay

[vi] VWHeritage Australia May 2016. (I fitted one in April, it failed on the first long trip).