Should I Buy a Syncro

1
Hi All

I have been following your posts for the past couple of months with great interest. I own a Vito, + a Hiace which I drive quite often + have owned a few T4s in the past + looking to buy a Syncro Panel Van.

I like the Hiace especially for it's reliability, but don't love the style, I feel deep down I am a VW guy.

But when I read your post they all seem to be around 'fixing them' or giving thanks that nothing broke on the trip to where ever.

Am I mad to buy one + spend years fixing it, I went through that with a Land Rover D2 which cost me 30K + 30K in repairs.

Can i buy a syncro that is reliable + won't cost a lot of money to keep on the road????

Regards

Garry


2
Guess I am reasonibly qualified to answer that at the moment Garry😛

I view it in a few ways. Number one is that all vehicle lifespans go in cycles. Somebody enjoyed the Jesus out of my car for many trouble free years, now it is at the point where everything needs to be fixed. It will one day be at a point where it once again can be enjoyed for many trouble free years. Just so happens many of these cars are at the "I need lots of work" cycle.

Secondly if you are on a forum asking the advice of a 100 strangers, you need help because you are at your wits end. You are less likely to tell everyone what a great trouble free week of travel you had. You are way too busy enjoying it! (Or posting on Instagram) simply for every 10 people fixing their bus there are 100 driving theres and not spending it on the internet.

Also I have noticed there are 2 distinct groups of internet mechanics. Those looking for a quick fix (I believe these are called HACKS)
And those that are just a little to picky and want their car to be as close to a new car as possible, so all they do is nut out those little details all day long. I like to hope I am in the later..... fact is,  for example the vibration I have right now, is really minor in the (my girlfriend did not even notice it was there) but I they could not have sold like that out of the factory, so something is not technically correct and it is good to have a bunch of like minded guys to throw ideas around with. Comes down to the standard you except, I know plenty of guys that would have just driven it the way it was. Much like your Hiace, there is a good chance that although you may see it as reliable and solid another persons perception may be that it is a piece of S#$t.

Will you spend money on a syncro? Depends on how much work you can do yourself. Parts are reasonibly dear and often hard to find, be cause I can do most of the work myself it offsets the cost. If i paid someone to do the wrench work, I could not afford it.

Wow, that turned it an essay

Nils




On Mon, 16 Oct 2017 at 1:07 PM, garry@mcmahonutri.com.au [Syncro_T3_Australia]
<Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Hi All

I have been following your posts for the past couple of months with great interest. I own a Vito, + a Hiace which I drive quite often + have owned a few T4s in the past + looking to buy a Syncro Panel Van.

I like the Hiace especially for it's reliability, but don't love the style, I feel deep down I am a VW guy.

But when I read your post they all seem to be around 'fixing them' or giving thanks that nothing broke on the trip to where ever.

Am I mad to buy one + spend years fixing it, I went through that with a Land Rover D2 which cost me 30K + 30K in repairs.

Can i buy a syncro that is reliable + won't cost a lot of money to keep on the road????

Regards

Garry


3
Hi Garry, 
from my experience... it seems pretty much that to have a good reliable and enjoyable synchro you either buy one cheap (about $10k if you're lucky) and then throw 10 or 20 at it bringing it up to 30k which should be a pretty good vehicle, or you spend top dollar straight out (30k) on one which has had the creases ironed out already and then plan to just maintain it well. I think the problems arise of you find a 'good' cheap van and expect you have a bargain as you most likely don't. They are great, characterful, head turning, conversation starting and adventure encouraging vehicles. But they are not hassle free, turn key vehicles. Its less that its a syncro, more that its probably 5 times older than the majority of vehicles still on the road. 
Mine started great, 5 years later needed a 6k engine rebuild and is waiting on power steering, bushes etc and then I imagine the cooling system will need to be brought up to scratch. But, I NEVER look enviously at a T5, a T6, a bay or a split. And it has never been more hassle than it is worth...and that is probably the key point. Like a tempestuous child, you love their flaws and their character. As l'Oreal says 'Because They're Worth It". 
Oh, and no matter how much money you throw at them, they seem to go up in value even faster...and that to me makes it a no brainer...like having one for free!
Cheers
Nick


On Tuesday, 17 October 2017, 9:46, "Nils Birkmann nilsbirkmann@yahoo.com [Syncro_T3_Australia]" <Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
Guess I am reasonibly qualified to answer that at the moment Garry😛

I view it in a few ways. Number one is that all vehicle lifespans go in cycles. Somebody enjoyed the Jesus out of my car for many trouble free years, now it is at the point where everything needs to be fixed. It will one day be at a point where it once again can be enjoyed for many trouble free years. Just so happens many of these cars are at the "I need lots of work" cycle.

Secondly if you are on a forum asking the advice of a 100 strangers, you need help because you are at your wits end. You are less likely to tell everyone what a great trouble free week of travel you had. You are way too busy enjoying it! (Or posting on Instagram) simply for every 10 people fixing their bus there are 100 driving theres and not spending it on the internet.

Also I have noticed there are 2 distinct groups of internet mechanics. Those looking for a quick fix (I believe these are called HACKS)
And those that are just a little to picky and want their car to be as close to a new car as possible, so all they do is nut out those little details all day long. I like to hope I am in the later..... fact is,  for example the vibration I have right now, is really minor in the (my girlfriend did not even notice it was there) but I they could not have sold like that out of the factory, so something is not technically correct and it is good to have a bunch of like minded guys to throw ideas around with. Comes down to the standard you except, I know plenty of guys that would have just driven it the way it was. Much like your Hiace, there is a good chance that although you may see it as reliable and solid another persons perception may be that it is a piece of S#$t.

Will you spend money on a syncro? Depends on how much work you can do yourself. Parts are reasonibly dear and often hard to find, be cause I can do most of the work myself it offsets the cost. If i paid someone to do the wrench work, I could not afford it.

Wow, that turned it an essay

Nils




On Mon, 16 Oct 2017 at 1:07 PM, garry@mcmahonutri.com.au [Syncro_T3_Australia]
<Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 
Hi All

I have been following your posts for the past couple of months with great interest. I own a Vito, + a Hiace which I drive quite often + have owned a few T4s in the past + looking to buy a Syncro Panel Van.

I like the Hiace especially for it's reliability, but don't love the style, I feel deep down I am a VW guy.

But when I read your post they all seem to be around 'fixing them' or giving thanks that nothing broke on the trip to where ever.

Am I mad to buy one + spend years fixing it, I went through that with a Land Rover D2 which cost me 30K + 30K in repairs.

Can i buy a syncro that is reliable + won't cost a lot of money to keep on the road????

Regards

Garry



4
Hi Garry, I agree with what others have said, you should buy mine!  There are some known issues with syncros (e.g. long coolant pipes, value of a decoupler, wbx engine heads if wrong coolant) however with some work I think these vans can end up better than factory.  Even if you had to do an engine conversion with the van you get, I don't think you would end up spending as much as you have spent on your Land Rover, especially if you are happy to get your hands dirty for some of the work.

Cheers, Sam
5
Hi Garry
I guess owning an old Rangie and an old Syncro puts me in an ideal position to comment - both are nearly thirty years old, and neither is given an easy life. I've driven them both for many years, and they have been very reliable for vehicles that old, but things wear out and need regular servicing and replacement. I rebuild the running gear and cooling systems on both vehicles every ten years and that is why they have been so reliable.

Having said that, the Rangie does need more maintenance than the VW simply because it has more systems to go wrong. Electric chairs, electric sunroof, electric mirrors and power windows sometimes play up.

The Rangie is the most incomparable 4WD on the planet, but if I had to get rid of one of my cars I would stick to the Syncro - its nearly as comfortable and almost as capable, and far more versatile.

They are the only two vehicles that have been displayed at the Louvre as works of art.

I've owned and restored over eighty vehicles, and owned all of the major brands of 4WD (and some that are pretty obscure) and one of them come close.

A word of warning though - restoring an old vehicle is very labour-intensive, so unless you have very deep pockets you need to do most of it yourself. That's where this forum comes in handy.

Roger.
6
Hi Roger,
We’ve had our first Syncro since about 1993.

Why do we love them ?

The ride: The monocoque construction combined with independent suspension, in my experience is so much better than chassis with semi elliptic springs.

The space: cubic metres with the rear seats removed.

Interior length:  I used to put 4 metre length of aluminium or timber through to the front passenger’s footwell,
and 2.4 X 1.2 m sheets of ply, etc., even with the seats in place.

Almost invincible because of the decoupler and diff locks both ends. 

Even with the stock engine, very adequate power and speed.

Amour plating underneath, especially the front spare wheel tray.

Satisfactory fuel consumption


Limiting features:
Ramp angles front and back.
Clearance to go over severe humps. 

Lack of a power take off, although they were available  on at least one market.

Shortage of factory spares, and quality of some of the replacements.


Getting the best out of our SYNCROs :
A good VW mechanic.
Drive it regularly.
Change engine oil every 7000 Ks.
Only use VW specified coolant in the right ratio.  
When rust appears, get it fixed. Get a really good panel beater.
Schedule replacement of consumables regularly: filters, belts, etc..

Hope this helps,

Peter
  


7
can only agree Peter, bought our first in 1988 from M&M. It was a Transporter Syncro 2 locks but an empty box with 2 seats in front. 
We swopped it in 1990 for the Doka TriStar (30 000 demo kms) we still own it today. Has done 402 000 kms.
Hartmut




On 18 Oct 2017, at 6:42 pm, Peter SCHWEINSBERG peter@peterandval.com [Syncro_T3_Australia] <Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Hi Roger,

We’ve had our first Syncro since about 1993.

Why do we love them ?

The ride: The monocoque construction combined with independent suspension, in my experience is so much better than chassis with semi elliptic springs.

The space: cubic metres with the rear seats removed.

Interior length:  I used to put 4 metre length of aluminium or timber through to the front passenger’s footwell,
and 2.4 X 1.2 m sheets of ply, etc., even with the seats in place.

Almost invincible because of the decoupler and diff locks both ends. 

Even with the stock engine, very adequate power and speed.

Amour plating underneath, especially the front spare wheel tray.

Satisfactory fuel consumption


Limiting features:
Ramp angles front and back.
Clearance to go over severe humps. 

Lack of a power take off, although they were available  on at least one market.

Shortage of factory spares, and quality of some of the replacements.


Getting the best out of our SYNCROs :
A good VW mechanic.
Drive it regularly.
Change engine oil every 7000 Ks.
Only use VW specified coolant in the right ratio.  
When rust appears, get it fixed. Get a really good panel beater.
Schedule replacement of consumables regularly: filters, belts, etc..

Hope this helps,

Peter
  




8
I've had Syncros for 14 years now. Beats others I've had with some mods and some $
With lockers and raised springs / bigger wheels it will go anywhere any other 4wd will.
I think I'm at about 290mm clearance now.
And then you've got a house when you get there ( Trakka camper fitout )
I thought $50k total spend was excessive until my brother told me his camper trailer cost $55k.
And I don't need to tow anything to be comfy.

Mark