4.86 ratio

1
Hi all.
What is the better final ratio 4.86 or 5.43. And What are the
advantages of a 4.86 in all aspects road & off road????
2
The 4.86 gives a higher road speed per thousand RPM, which is good for bitumen road travelling.  The 5.43 gives a lower road speed per thousand RPM, which is better for secondary gravel roads, fire trails and the like.  To the best of my knowledge, all Australian delivery Syncros came with 5.43.  The change-over cost is formidable - around 1200/1300 per ring and pinion set - plus the installation,  and you need two sets.
 
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 3:47 PM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] 4.86 ratio

Hi all.
What is the better final ratio 4.86 or 5.43. And What are the
advantages of a 4.86 in all aspects road & off road????

3
I hear what u are saying. Is it any cheaper if u have a rear gearbox
with the 4.86 already lined up and on its way? I have been told by
LONG ENTERPRISES
VW Transaxle Specialist
http://www.longenterprises.com

in the USA that the 4.86 was and is the stronger of the ratios?? And
also if u had your choice, which would u use??
Is this 4.86 diff ratio a good fit to 15inch rim and tyre or do/can i
go higher to the 16 inch version without modifications???






--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Les Harris"
<leslieharris@...> wrote:
>
> The 4.86 gives a higher road speed per thousand RPM, which is good
for bitumen road travelling. The 5.43 gives a lower road speed per
thousand RPM, which is better for secondary gravel roads, fire trails
and the like. To the best of my knowledge, all Australian delivery
Syncros came with 5.43. The change-over cost is formidable - around
1200/1300 per ring and pinion set - plus the installation, and you
need two sets.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: syncrosity4now
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 3:47 PM
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] 4.86 ratio
>
>
> Hi all.
> What is the better final ratio 4.86 or 5.43. And What are the
> advantages of a 4.86 in all aspects road & off road????
>
4

Here’s a link to gearbox ratio’s : http://busman.be/pagina53aaa.html

The shortest ratio is 4.57 making the car real fast. That one came only on 14 inches.

Quite some petrol 16ers had the 4.86 ratio, giving the car a top speed of 141 km/h, that is, if you’ve got enough power and if the car’s not too heavy.

The longest ratio on a 16inch is 6.16. They only put these in 1600TD’s. Top speed is 116km/h, cruising speed… about 90 km/h. Put these boxes in a 14 inch and they will increase your torque at the wheels dramatically, making your G gear very short which is great for offroading. On the highway this setup will be a nightmare. Your top speed will drop a lot, might be something like 90 km/h in a 14 inch with a cruising speed of 90 km on the highway, don’t know if anyone did something like that. But for offroading it should be fantastic.

I will be putting such a 6. 14 inch 1600TD later this year.

 

Don’t know what you mean with “strong” though. If it comes to stronger gears Australia is the place to be. As far as I know only albino gears in Australia makes stronger gears for the 3rd and 4th gear that’s where you need it, especially if one puts in a stronger than standard engine. And when doing so one should also put in the SA oiling plates.

 

Mike Plompen

Van: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com ] Namens syncrosity4now
Verzonden: donderdag 8 februari 2007 11:13
Aan: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Onderwerp: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: 4.86 ratio

 

I hear what u are saying. Is it any cheaper if u have a rear gearbox
with the 4.86 already lined up and on its way? I have been told by
LONG ENTERPRISES
VW Transaxle Specialist
http://www.longente rprises.com

in the USA that the 4.86 was and is the stronger of the ratios?? And
also if u had your choice, which would u use??
Is this 4.86 diff ratio a good fit to 15inch rim and tyre or do/can i
go higher to the 16 inch version without modifications? ??

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com, "Les Harris"
<leslieharris@ ...> wrote:

>
> The 4.86 gives a higher road speed per thousand RPM, which is good
for bitumen road travelling. The 5.43 gives a lower road speed per
thousand RPM, which is better for secondary gravel roads, fire trails
and the like. To the best of my knowledge, all Australian delivery
Syncros came with 5.43. The change-over cost is formidable - around
1200/1300 per ring and pinion set - plus the installation, and you
need two sets.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: syncrosity4now
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com
> Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 3:47 PM
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] 4.86 ratio
>
>
> Hi all.
> What is the better final ratio 4.86 or 5.43. And What are the
> advantages of a 4.86 in all aspects road & off road????
>

5
Ok So all in all the 4.86 should be very good in the bush and highway
with 15 inch rubber/rim.
What about an oil cooler, i have had this mentioned to me at various
times??
Not really caring about the top speed 105-120 should be sufficent when
cruising and overtaking, just looking for a decent amount of torque in
the rough stuff.



--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Mike" <borzeken@...> wrote:
>
> Here's a link to gearbox ratio's : http://busman.be/pagina53aaa.html
>
> The shortest ratio is 4.57 making the car real fast. That one came
only on
> 14 inches.
>
> Quite some petrol 16ers had the 4.86 ratio, giving the car a top
speed of
> 141 km/h, that is, if you've got enough power and if the car's not too
> heavy.
>
> The longest ratio on a 16inch is 6.16. They only put these in
1600TD's. Top
> speed is 116km/h, cruising speed. about 90 km/h. Put these boxes in a 14
> inch and they will increase your torque at the wheels dramatically,
making
> your G gear very short which is great for offroading. On the highway
this
> setup will be a nightmare. Your top speed will drop a lot, might be
> something like 90 km/h in a 14 inch with a cruising speed of 90 km
on the
> highway, don't know if anyone did something like that. But for
offroading it
> should be fantastic.
>
> I will be putting such a 6. 14 inch 1600TD later this year.
>
>
>
> Don't know what you mean with "strong" though. If it comes to
stronger gears
> Australia is the place to be. As far as I know only albino gears in
> Australia makes stronger gears for the 3rd and 4th gear that's where you
> need it, especially if one puts in a stronger than standard engine.
And when
> doing so one should also put in the SA oiling plates.
>
>
>
> Mike Plompen
>
> _____
>
> Van: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] Namens syncrosity4now
> Verzonden: donderdag 8 februari 2007 11:13
> Aan: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Onderwerp: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: 4.86 ratio
>
>
>
> I hear what u are saying. Is it any cheaper if u have a rear gearbox
> with the 4.86 already lined up and on its way? I have been told by
> LONG ENTERPRISES
> VW Transaxle Specialist
> http://www.longente <http://www.longenterprises.com> rprises.com
>
> in the USA that the 4.86 was and is the stronger of the ratios?? And
> also if u had your choice, which would u use??
> Is this 4.86 diff ratio a good fit to 15inch rim and tyre or do/can i
> go higher to the 16 inch version without modifications???
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia
<mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> @yahoogroups.com, "Les Harris"
> <leslieharris@> wrote:
> >
> > The 4.86 gives a higher road speed per thousand RPM, which is good
> for bitumen road travelling. The 5.43 gives a lower road speed per
> thousand RPM, which is better for secondary gravel roads, fire trails
> and the like. To the best of my knowledge, all Australian delivery
> Syncros came with 5.43. The change-over cost is formidable - around
> 1200/1300 per ring and pinion set - plus the installation, and you
> need two sets.
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: syncrosity4now
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> @yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 3:47 PM
> > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] 4.86 ratio
> >
> >
> > Hi all.
> > What is the better final ratio 4.86 or 5.43. And What are the
> > advantages of a 4.86 in all aspects road & off road????
> >
>
6
Hi,

My advice - please undertake careful research on this subject before you commit to any
changes in the ring and pinion sets, especially if you also intend to run taller tyres and
doubly so if you intend to remain using the original VW engine.

I wouldn't tell any one that set up "X" is wrong but you must make sure you know the end
results that you will achieve are suitable for your intended application - and everyone is
different in this regard.

My belief (and I stress MY) is that a set up that included 4.86 ratio R&P's, tall tyres and the
VW wbxer would struggle along a highway and would not have a very low 'crawler' speed
for off road use. Of course the actual gear ratios will also have an affect on the end result.
However, I have not read much on this for a couple of years so I may have my facts wrong.
Someone else wish to make comment..........

I would suggest that you use the gearbox calculator in the files section of this site and
search on the US Yahoo Syncro site for years worth of R&D on exactly this topic. You are
obviously going to spend considerable time, money and effort on your van and this is the
type of work you want to get right first time.

Andrew (OzSyncro) had some problems when he changed his 4th gear and may have some
useful input. (Are you out the Andrew?)

Good luck and keep asking questions!

Cheers,

Andy
Ceduna.
7
Thanks for the input but i am semi comitted to going with the 4.86
ratio as i have arranged to have it shipped from Germany and well it
comes with the all important diff locks, so i think i only need to
delve into the front gearbox and make the necessary changes???

Other than this i will be keeping the 15inch rim and tyre combo. So
hopefully it wont make it too much of a handful, in the on road/off
road application.
But i am only learning so i will listen intently and observe all input.
As for "semi comitted" i bought the Syncro off ebay, got it cheap and
well got the gearbox just as cheap even with freight and import and
the gearbox is kaputt according to Rudi, so i had to do it one way or
another just to get mobile and as the gearbox i have just bought has
only 110 thousand K's on it i intend on using it, Hopefully???
Yes it will cost me to have the front ratio replaced, but hopefully
not too much, seem to be having some luck with my Syncro, so far....
Cheers
Andrew
92 Transporter Syncro





--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "raredownunder"
<rafear@...> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> My advice - please undertake careful research on this subject before
you commit to any
> changes in the ring and pinion sets, especially if you also intend
to run taller tyres and
> doubly so if you intend to remain using the original VW engine.
>
> I wouldn't tell any one that set up "X" is wrong but you must make
sure you know the end
> results that you will achieve are suitable for your intended
application - and everyone is
> different in this regard.
>
> My belief (and I stress MY) is that a set up that included 4.86
ratio R&P's, tall tyres and the
> VW wbxer would struggle along a highway and would not have a very
low 'crawler' speed
> for off road use. Of course the actual gear ratios will also have an
affect on the end result.
> However, I have not read much on this for a couple of years so I may
have my facts wrong.
> Someone else wish to make comment..........
>
> I would suggest that you use the gearbox calculator in the files
section of this site and
> search on the US Yahoo Syncro site for years worth of R&D on exactly
this topic. You are
> obviously going to spend considerable time, money and effort on your
van and this is the
> type of work you want to get right first time.
>
> Andrew (OzSyncro) had some problems when he changed his 4th gear and
may have some
> useful input. (Are you out the Andrew?)
>
> Good luck and keep asking questions!
>
> Cheers,
>
> Andy
> Ceduna.
>
8

Don’t forget that when you put on your larger tires your top speed will increase (that is, if you look at gps speed off course) IF the engine can pull it.

That depends on what engine you have, how many horses are still alive, what tire profile you are driving, what kind of rubbish you transport on the roof J. and what’s your car’s weight.

And, also, when you put on these larger tires your speed in G will increase a lot as well PLUS the torque will be considerably lower because of the larger tires you will be putting on  !

 

So you can’t have the best of both worlds : a high top speed and lots of torque down low, unless you get yourself a gearbox with the biggest ratio and then making the 3rd and 4th gear way longer. Therefore you will definitely need a strong engine as you will have huge gaps between 2nd and 3rd and 3rd and 4th gear. On the other hand, putting in a very powerfull engine to close these gaps will make your engine suffer a lot. A huge increase in torque will harm your gearbox more when the gears are spread widely then when they follow one another very short, meaning : an alternative engine that gives 220Nm at 4000 rpm will harm more if you change the gearbox allowing the car to make a top speed of 150 km/h then when you alter the gearbox giving it a top speed of 120 km/h. Either way, stronger 3rd and 4th gear would we recommended with a engine setup like that.

 

One more thing, HP’s is what you need for high top speeds, NM’s torque you need for having power to pull and to perform offroad. When tuning an engine it’s often a choice : either you tune it to get more HP’s out of it, either you tune it to get more torque. Same goes for exhaust tuning like spaghetti exhausts.

 

But you’re working in the right direction. You will get a bigger difference in performing at a lower cost by changing the ratio’s (tire size also being part of ratio changing) then when trying to do the same with swapping engines or putting on turbo’s, intercoolers, compressors etc.

 

Oil coolers are cool J They will make your engine last longer.

 

Mike plompen

www.busman.be

www.wbx6.com

 

 

 

Van: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com ] Namens syncrosity4now
Verzonden: donderdag 8 februari 2007 11:43
Aan: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Onderwerp: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: 4.86 ratio

 

Ok So all in all the 4.86 should be very good in the bush and highway
with 15 inch rubber/rim.
What about an oil cooler, i have had this mentioned to me at various
times??
Not really caring about the top speed 105-120 should be sufficent when
cruising and overtaking, just looking for a decent amount of torque in
the rough stuff.

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com, "Mike" <borzeken@.. .> wrote:

>
> Here's a link to gearbox ratio's :
href="http://busman.be/pagina53aaa.html">http://busman. be/pagina53aaa. html
>
> The shortest ratio is 4.57 making the car real fast. That one came
only on
> 14 inches.
>
> Quite some petrol 16ers had the 4.86 ratio, giving the car a top
speed of
> 141 km/h, that is, if you've got enough power and if the car's not too
> heavy.
>
> The longest ratio on a 16inch is 6.16. They only put these in
1600TD's. Top
> speed is 116km/h, cruising speed. about 90 km/h. Put these boxes in a 14
> inch and they will increase your torque at the wheels dramatically,
making
> your G gear very short which is great for offroading. On the highway
this
> setup will be a nightmare. Your top speed will drop a lot, might be
> something like 90 km/h in a 14 inch with a cruising speed of 90 km
on the
> highway, don't know if anyone did something like that. But for
offroading it
> should be fantastic.
>
> I will be putting such a 6. 14 inch 1600TD later this year.
>
>
>
> Don't know what you mean with "strong" though. If it comes to
stronger gears
> Australia is the place to be. As far as I know only albino gears in
> Australia makes stronger gears for the 3rd and 4th gear that's where you
> need it, especially if one puts in a stronger than standard engine.
And when
> doing so one should also put in the SA oiling plates.
>
>
>
> Mike Plompen
>
> _____
>
> Van: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com]
Namens syncrosity4now
> Verzonden: donderdag 8 februari 2007 11:13
> Aan: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com
> Onderwerp: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Re: 4.86 ratio
>
>
>
> I hear what u are saying. Is it any cheaper if u have a rear gearbox
> with the 4.86 already lined up and on its way? I have been told by
> LONG ENTERPRISES
> VW Transaxle Specialist
> http://www.longente <
href="http://www.longenterprises.com">http://www.longente rprises.com> rprises.com
>
> in the USA that the 4.86 was and is the stronger of the ratios?? And
> also if u had your choice, which would u use??
> Is this 4.86 diff ratio a good fit to 15inch rim and tyre or do/can i
> go higher to the 16 inch version without modifications? ??
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia
<mailto:Syncro_ T3_Australia% 40yahoogroups. com>
> @yahoogroups. com, "Les Harris"
> <leslieharris@ > wrote:
> >
> > The 4.86 gives a higher road speed per thousand RPM, which is good
> for bitumen road travelling. The 5.43 gives a lower road speed per
> thousand RPM, which is better for secondary gravel roads, fire trails
> and the like. To the best of my knowledge, all Australian delivery
> Syncros came with 5.43. The change-over cost is formidable - around
> 1200/1300 per ring and pinion set - plus the installation, and you
> need two sets.
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: syncrosity4now
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia <mailto:Syncro_ T3_Australia% 40yahoogroups. com>
> @yahoogroups. com
> > Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 3:47 PM
> > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] 4.86 ratio
> >
> >
> > Hi all.
> > What is the better final ratio 4.86 or 5.43. And What are the
> > advantages of a 4.86 in all aspects road & off road????
> >
>

9
Yes i am aware of all this to a certain point, as for modifications to
the enginre the only thig i may do at present is give throw on some
1.25 ratio rockers and a decent high flow cat and muffler system oh
and som 4 prong spark plugs if i can find them(havent looked yet).
So as to the gearbox i am hoping by keeping it relatively stock and
keep it standard except for maybe for a heavy duty 3rd 4th. And at
some stage a decent heavy duty diff set.
So by matching my gearbox ratios and tyres and keeping it relatively
stock i seem to be making some headway and choosing the right path. My
motor is a 2.1ltr so i am fairly confident it will take the load of 15
inch tyres and a 4.86 diff ratio. Not really caring about top speed as
we all know it counts for nothing in the bush, so i am more so going
for a finer balance.



--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Mike" <borzeken@...> wrote:
>
> Don't forget that when you put on your larger tires your top speed will
> increase (that is, if you look at gps speed off course) IF the
engine can
> pull it.
>
> That depends on what engine you have, how many horses are still
alive, what
> tire profile you are driving, what kind of rubbish you transport on
the roof
> :-). and what's your car's weight.
>
> And, also, when you put on these larger tires your speed in G will
increase
> a lot as well PLUS the torque will be considerably lower because of the
> larger tires you will be putting on !
>
>
>
> So you can't have the best of both worlds : a high top speed and lots of
> torque down low, unless you get yourself a gearbox with the biggest
ratio
> and then making the 3rd and 4th gear way longer. Therefore you will
> definitely need a strong engine as you will have huge gaps between
2nd and
> 3rd and 3rd and 4th gear. On the other hand, putting in a very powerfull
> engine to close these gaps will make your engine suffer a lot. A huge
> increase in torque will harm your gearbox more when the gears are spread
> widely then when they follow one another very short, meaning : an
> alternative engine that gives 220Nm at 4000 rpm will harm more if
you change
> the gearbox allowing the car to make a top speed of 150 km/h then
when you
> alter the gearbox giving it a top speed of 120 km/h. Either way,
stronger
> 3rd and 4th gear would we recommended with a engine setup like that.
>
>
>
> One more thing, HP's is what you need for high top speeds, NM's
torque you
> need for having power to pull and to perform offroad. When tuning an
engine
> it's often a choice : either you tune it to get more HP's out of it,
either
> you tune it to get more torque. Same goes for exhaust tuning like
spaghetti
> exhausts.
>
>
>
> But you're working in the right direction. You will get a bigger
difference
> in performing at a lower cost by changing the ratio's (tire size
also being
> part of ratio changing) then when trying to do the same with swapping
> engines or putting on turbo's, intercoolers, compressors etc.
>
>
>
> Oil coolers are cool :-) They will make your engine last longer.
>
>
>
> Mike plompen
>
> www.busman.be <http://www.busman.be/>
>
> www.wbx6.com <http://www.wbx6.com/>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _____
>
> Van: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] Namens syncrosity4now
> Verzonden: donderdag 8 februari 2007 11:43
> Aan: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Onderwerp: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: 4.86 ratio
>
>
>
> Ok So all in all the 4.86 should be very good in the bush and highway
> with 15 inch rubber/rim.
> What about an oil cooler, i have had this mentioned to me at various
> times??
> Not really caring about the top speed 105-120 should be sufficent when
> cruising and overtaking, just looking for a decent amount of torque in
> the rough stuff.
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia
<mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> @yahoogroups.com, "Mike" <borzeken@> wrote:
> >
> > Here's a link to gearbox ratio's : http://busman.
> <http://busman.be/pagina53aaa.html> be/pagina53aaa.html
> >
> > The shortest ratio is 4.57 making the car real fast. That one came
> only on
> > 14 inches.
> >
> > Quite some petrol 16ers had the 4.86 ratio, giving the car a top
> speed of
> > 141 km/h, that is, if you've got enough power and if the car's not too
> > heavy.
> >
> > The longest ratio on a 16inch is 6.16. They only put these in
> 1600TD's. Top
> > speed is 116km/h, cruising speed. about 90 km/h. Put these boxes
in a 14
> > inch and they will increase your torque at the wheels dramatically,
> making
> > your G gear very short which is great for offroading. On the highway
> this
> > setup will be a nightmare. Your top speed will drop a lot, might be
> > something like 90 km/h in a 14 inch with a cruising speed of 90 km
> on the
> > highway, don't know if anyone did something like that. But for
> offroading it
> > should be fantastic.
> >
> > I will be putting such a 6. 14 inch 1600TD later this year.
> >
> >
> >
> > Don't know what you mean with "strong" though. If it comes to
> stronger gears
> > Australia is the place to be. As far as I know only albino gears in
> > Australia makes stronger gears for the 3rd and 4th gear that's
where you
> > need it, especially if one puts in a stronger than standard engine.
> And when
> > doing so one should also put in the SA oiling plates.
> >
> >
> >
> > Mike Plompen
> >
> > _____
> >
> > Van: Syncro_T3_Australia
<mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> @yahoogroups.com
> > [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia
<mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> @yahoogroups.com] Namens syncrosity4now
> > Verzonden: donderdag 8 februari 2007 11:13
> > Aan: Syncro_T3_Australia
<mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> @yahoogroups.com
> > Onderwerp: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: 4.86 ratio
> >
> >
> >
> > I hear what u are saying. Is it any cheaper if u have a rear gearbox
> > with the 4.86 already lined up and on its way? I have been told by
> > LONG ENTERPRISES
> > VW Transaxle Specialist
> > http://www.longente <http://www.longente
<http://www.longenterprises.com>
> rprises.com> rprises.com
> >
> > in the USA that the 4.86 was and is the stronger of the ratios?? And
> > also if u had your choice, which would u use??
> > Is this 4.86 diff ratio a good fit to 15inch rim and tyre or do/can i
> > go higher to the 16 inch version without modifications???
> >
> > --- In Syncro_T3_Australia
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > @yahoogroups.com, "Les Harris"
> > <leslieharris@> wrote:
> > >
> > > The 4.86 gives a higher road speed per thousand RPM, which is good
> > for bitumen road travelling. The 5.43 gives a lower road speed per
> > thousand RPM, which is better for secondary gravel roads, fire trails
> > and the like. To the best of my knowledge, all Australian delivery
> > Syncros came with 5.43. The change-over cost is formidable - around
> > 1200/1300 per ring and pinion set - plus the installation, and you
> > need two sets.
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: syncrosity4now
> > > To: Syncro_T3_Australia
<mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > @yahoogroups.com
> > > Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 3:47 PM
> > > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] 4.86 ratio
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi all.
> > > What is the better final ratio 4.86 or 5.43. And What are the
> > > advantages of a 4.86 in all aspects road & off road????
> > >
> >
>
10
The 2.1 is no ball of fire but that's what most of us use.  There's not a lot of point trying to up the power of it because the cost benefit ratio is miniscule.  The standard 2WD T3 has 4.86 and the Syncro runs quite well on the same ratio.  The wheel size comes into it, but it is the tyre size that determines the revs per kilometre and in turn the distance travelled, not the rim diameter on its own.  You lose a bit of flexibility off road, particularly in the lower gears but it wouldn't bother a competent driver.  The 6+ ratios are strictly full time off road stuff.  On normal roads, they turn the Syncro into a mobile chicane.  The Albins 3/4 gear set is of a higher ratio - higher road speed per 1000 RPM.
 
If you want to significantly improve the power/torque, you should consider going Subaru, particularly the 2.5.  It costs, but worth it in the end.  Several members of this group have done it.
 
Remember that you will have to get a 2WD T3 speedo if you change the front diff ratio.
 
Les
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 10:59 PM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: 4.86 ratio

Yes i am aware of all this to a certain point, as for modifications to
the enginre the only thig i may do at present is give throw on some
1.25 ratio rockers and a decent high flow cat and muffler system oh
and som 4 prong spark plugs if i can find them(havent looked yet).
So as to the gearbox i am hoping by keeping it relatively stock and
keep it standard except for maybe for a heavy duty 3rd 4th. And at
some stage a decent heavy duty diff set.
So by matching my gearbox ratios and tyres and keeping it relatively
stock i seem to be making some headway and choosing the right path. My
motor is a 2.1ltr so i am fairly confident it will take the load of 15
inch tyres and a 4.86 diff ratio. Not really caring about top speed as
we all know it counts for nothing in the bush, so i am more so going
for a finer balance.

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com, "Mike" <borzeken@.. .> wrote:

.

11
Hey i got a standard T3 caravelle box down stairs, 85 model, can i use
the ring and pinion from this box and insert into the front end???




--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Les Harris"
<leslieharris@...> wrote:
>
> The 2.1 is no ball of fire but that's what most of us use. There's
not a lot of point trying to up the power of it because the cost
benefit ratio is miniscule. The standard 2WD T3 has 4.86 and the
Syncro runs quite well on the same ratio. The wheel size comes into
it, but it is the tyre size that determines the revs per kilometre and
in turn the distance travelled, not the rim diameter on its own. You
lose a bit of flexibility off road, particularly in the lower gears
but it wouldn't bother a competent driver. The 6+ ratios are strictly
full time off road stuff. On normal roads, they turn the Syncro into
a mobile chicane. The Albins 3/4 gear set is of a higher ratio -
higher road speed per 1000 RPM.
>
> If you want to significantly improve the power/torque, you should
consider going Subaru, particularly the 2.5. It costs, but worth it
in the end. Several members of this group have done it.
>
> Remember that you will have to get a 2WD T3 speedo if you change the
front diff ratio.
>
> Les
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: syncrosity4now
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 10:59 PM
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: 4.86 ratio
>
>
> Yes i am aware of all this to a certain point, as for modifications to
> the enginre the only thig i may do at present is give throw on some
> 1.25 ratio rockers and a decent high flow cat and muffler system oh
> and som 4 prong spark plugs if i can find them(havent looked yet).
> So as to the gearbox i am hoping by keeping it relatively stock and
> keep it standard except for maybe for a heavy duty 3rd 4th. And at
> some stage a decent heavy duty diff set.
> So by matching my gearbox ratios and tyres and keeping it relatively
> stock i seem to be making some headway and choosing the right path. My
> motor is a 2.1ltr so i am fairly confident it will take the load of 15
> inch tyres and a 4.86 diff ratio. Not really caring about top speed as
> we all know it counts for nothing in the bush, so i am more so going
> for a finer balance.
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Mike" <borzeken@> wrote:
>
> Recent Activity
> a.. 2New Members
> b.. 9New Photos
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>
12
> Remember that you will have to get a 2WD T3 speedo if you change the
> front diff ratio.
>
> Les
>

2WD speedo will not work as it is driven off the front wheel. (1:1 ratio)

I think the diff ratio may not be that important to top speed as I think that the gear ratios may be different. (Not sure, I will have to check that one)

Phill
13

HI Les,

 

I think you’re wrong about the 2wd speedo.  As I recall, the 2wd van drives its speedo off the LH front wheel, unlike the syncro, which drives of the back of the front diff.  The 2wd speedo ratios are completely unrelated to diff ratios (and I think about 2:1 different to syncro speedos.)  Alternate speedo drive gears are available (not sure how easily) for syncros, to suit various diff ratios, but I would check and see how accurate the speedo is with the particular diff ratio/tyre combination before altering it.

 

 

BRIAN REED

FAIRFIELD NATURAL THERAPIES

185 Wingrove St

Fairfield, Vic. 3078

03 9481 5673   0407 319 521

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Les Harris
Sent: Friday, 9 February 2007 9:38 AM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: 4.86 ratio

 

The 2.1 is no ball of fire but that's what most of us use.  There's not a lot of point trying to up the power of it because the cost benefit ratio is miniscule.  The standard 2WD T3 has 4.86 and the Syncro runs quite well on the same ratio.  The wheel size comes into it, but it is the tyre size that determines the revs per kilometre and in turn the distance travelled, not the rim diameter on its own.  You lose a bit of flexibility off road, particularly in the lower gears but it wouldn't bother a competent driver.  The 6+ ratios are strictly full time off road stuff.  On normal roads, they turn the Syncro into a mobile chicane.  The Albins 3/4 gear set is of a higher ratio - higher road speed per 1000 RPM.

 

If you want to significantly improve the power/torque, you should consider going Subaru, particularly the 2.5.  It costs, but worth it in the end.  Several members of this group have done it.

 

Remember that you will have to get a 2WD T3 speedo if you change the front diff ratio.

 

Les

 

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 10:59 PM

Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Re: 4.86 ratio

 

Yes i am aware of all this to a certain point, as for modifications to
the enginre the only thig i may do at present is give throw on some
1.25 ratio rockers and a decent high flow cat and muffler system oh
and som 4 prong spark plugs if i can find them(havent looked yet).
So as to the gearbox i am hoping by keeping it relatively stock and
keep it standard except for maybe for a heavy duty 3rd 4th. And at
some stage a decent heavy duty diff set.
So by matching my gearbox ratios and tyres and keeping it relatively
stock i seem to be making some headway and choosing the right path. My
motor is a 2.1ltr so i am fairly confident it will take the load of 15
inch tyres and a 4.86 diff ratio. Not really caring about top speed as
we all know it counts for nothing in the bush, so i am more so going
for a finer balance.

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com, "Mike" <borzeken@.. .> wrote:

.



14

To Victorian members,

 

I’ve just booked for the VWCV Kennett River weekend away. (March 2,3,4. Bookings direct with Kennett River Caravan Park  1300 664 417)  Any-one else likely to be there?  If there are a few of us, it might be possible to explore some tracks back up in the Otways (probably Saturday afternoon).  Does any-one have local knowledge of the area that they can pass on.

 

BRIAN REED

FAIRFIELD NATURAL THERAPIES

185 Wingrove St

Fairfield, Vic. 3078

03 9481 5673   0407 319 521

15

Hi les,

 

Or when one wants more power but wants to keep it a volkswagen and not a vw-subaru mixture one ha sfour options :

 

1)Add a turbo and intercooler, a german company does so (Schick), giving the DJ 163 hp and 280Nm torque, a south african company also did it (turbovans I think they were called).

2) Add a compressor (supercharger), e.g. from a new Mini, but then start from an MV engine or, when starting from the DJ bring down the compression ratio in the car first

3) Put in a 3.2 oettinger, it’s basically the same as the DJ but with two extra cylinders. (or the tuned version, the 3.7 oettinger

4) Last possibility, still VW original : put in an audi 2.5 or 2.6 like they did in the T3’s they build till about a year or two ago. They also stopped production of the Syncro in 1992 so that only two syncro’s came originally with this engine. But in the later T3’s it became the standard thus replacing the waterboxer. There’s an OEM bellhousing that makes you bolt the audi engine right onto your gearbox

 

For those who also see their cars as collectors items, changing it into Subaru is not an option. It’s also not that easy but I agree it’s a great engine. But the other options are often forgotten, don’t know why but according to me they are the way to go

 

 

Van: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com ] Namens Les Harris
Verzonden: donderdag 8 februari 2007 23:38
Aan: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: 4.86 ratio

 

The 2.1 is no ball of fire but that's what most of us use.  There's not a lot of point trying to up the power of it because the cost benefit ratio is miniscule.  The standard 2WD T3 has 4.86 and the Syncro runs quite well on the same ratio.  The wheel size comes into it, but it is the tyre size that determines the revs per kilometre and in turn the distance travelled, not the rim diameter on its own.  You lose a bit of flexibility off road, particularly in the lower gears but it wouldn't bother a competent driver.  The 6+ ratios are strictly full time off road stuff.  On normal roads, they turn the Syncro into a mobile chicane.  The Albins 3/4 gear set is of a higher ratio - higher road speed per 1000 RPM.

 

If you want to significantly improve the power/torque, you should consider going Subaru, particularly the 2.5.  It costs, but worth it in the end.  Several members of this group have done it.

 

Remember that you will have to get a 2WD T3 speedo if you change the front diff ratio.

 

Les

 

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 10:59 PM

Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Re: 4.86 ratio

 

Yes i am aware of all this to a certain point, as for modifications to
the enginre the only thig i may do at present is give throw on some
1.25 ratio rockers and a decent high flow cat and muffler system oh
and som 4 prong spark plugs if i can find them(havent looked yet).
So as to the gearbox i am hoping by keeping it relatively stock and
keep it standard except for maybe for a heavy duty 3rd 4th. And at
some stage a decent heavy duty diff set.
So by matching my gearbox ratios and tyres and keeping it relatively
stock i seem to be making some headway and choosing the right path. My
motor is a 2.1ltr so i am fairly confident it will take the load of 15
inch tyres and a 4.86 diff ratio. Not really caring about top speed as
we all know it counts for nothing in the bush, so i am more so going
for a finer balance.

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com, "Mike" <borzeken@.. .> wrote:

.



16
Mike,
 
I agree with all that but there is one significant difference in Australia.
 
The Subaru is very common here and has been on the scene for a very long time.  There are many dealers and there are many on the roads, there is a good pool of dealer knowledge (workshop knowledge), and spares are adequately represented, probably far better than Volkswagen.
 
Volkswagen has had an on and off relationship with Australia over 40 or more years.  They have gone for extreme to extreme.  They have gone from having a big factory at Clayton in Melbourne to having no presence in Australia whatsoever.  During these latter times, they appointed Australian distributors, with varying results. 
 
Whenever a company blows hot and cold, they inevitably erode the confidence base of their customers.  Many have done it and many have paid the price.  It's not confined to the automotive market; it happens in other fields.  Suzuki did it recently with outboard motors and they are now struggling to regain their once good market share.  Subaru have had a constant presence in Australia and have built up a strong reputation as a result. 
 
The matter of keeping to the original spec is up to the individual owner.  I happen to have a good 2.1 MV but would not hesitate to go the Subaru path if it got to be a problem.
 
Conversely, Audi does not have a big presence in Australia, with the commensurate problems with sourcing spares.  Oettingers do not exist in Australia, so forget about spares.  Adding turbos or superchargers falls into the same field - you would need to be very sure of spares support before going that path.
 
So, in summary, this is not a question of alternatives being "forgotten" in Australia, it is simply a matter of pragmatics.  If such alternatives do not exist in Australia or have no support or spares in Australia, you would need to be very brave (or very rich) to choose to go that way. 
 
Les
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Mike
Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 5:25 PM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] adding power

Hi les,

Or when one wants more power but wants to keep it a volkswagen and not a vw-subaru mixture one ha sfour options :

1)Add a turbo and intercooler, a german company does so (Schick), giving the DJ 163 hp and 280Nm torque, a south african company also did it (turbovans I think they were called).

2) Add a compressor (supercharger) , e.g. from a new Mini, but then start from an MV engine or, when starting from the DJ bring down the compression ratio in the car first

3) Put in a 3.2 oettinger, it’s basically the same as the DJ but with two extra cylinders. (or the tuned version, the 3.7 oettinger

4) Last possibility, still VW original : put in an audi 2.5 or 2.6 like they did in the T3’s they build till about a year or two ago. They also stopped production of the Syncro in 1992 so that only two syncro’s came originally with this engine. But in the later T3’s it became the standard thus replacing the waterboxer. There’s an OEM bellhousing that makes you bolt the audi engine right onto your gearbox

For those who also see their cars as collectors items, changing it into Subaru is not an option. It’s also not that easy but I agree it’s a great engine. But the other options are often forgotten, don’t know why but according to me they are the way to go

Van: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com [mailto: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com ] Namens Les Harris
Verzonden: donderdag 8 februari 2007 23:38
Aan: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com
Onderwerp: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Re: 4.86 ratio

The 2.1 is no ball of fire but that's what most of us use.  There's not a lot of point trying to up the power of it because the cost benefit ratio is miniscule.  The standard 2WD T3 has 4.86 and the Syncro runs quite well on the same ratio.  The wheel size comes into it, but it is the tyre size that determines the revs per kilometre and in turn the distance travelled, not the rim diameter on its own.  You lose a bit of flexibility off road, particularly in the lower gears but it wouldn't bother a competent driver.  The 6+ ratios are strictly full time off road stuff.  On normal roads, they turn the Syncro into a mobile chicane.  The Albins 3/4 gear set is of a higher ratio - higher road speed per 1000 RPM.

If you want to significantly improve the power/torque, you should consider going Subaru, particularly the 2.5.  It costs, but worth it in the end.  Several members of this group have done it.

Remember that you will have to get a 2WD T3 speedo if you change the front diff ratio.

Les

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 10:59 PM

Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Re: 4.86 ratio

Yes i am aware of all this to a certain point, as for modifications to
the enginre the only thig i may do at present is give throw on some
1.25 ratio rockers and a decent high flow cat and muffler system oh
and som 4 prong spark plugs if i can find them(havent looked yet).
So as to the gearbox i am hoping by keeping it relatively stock and
keep it standard except for maybe for a heavy duty 3rd 4th. And at
some stage a decent heavy duty diff set.
So by matching my gearbox ratios and tyres and keeping it relatively
stock i seem to be making some headway and choosing the right path. My
motor is a 2.1ltr so i am fairly confident it will take the load of 15
inch tyres and a 4.86 diff ratio. Not really caring about top speed as
we all know it counts for nothing in the bush, so i am more so going
for a finer balance.

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com, "Mike" <borzeken@.. .> wrote:

.



17
Hey Mike i think u forgot Go Westy, these guys are still making the
wasserboxer style engine with options of 2.3, 2.5, and 2.7(?) not
quite sure on the last and they do a bloody good job, if only it
werent so pricey one may consider it. Oh and they also do the amped up
version of each motor, of course u can still rebuild the stock 2.1 or
other.
I think here in Aus Subaru option is taken because cost of rebuild vs
straight swap out.
If my motor goes Bang and throws a piston through case or other
terminal death.
I dont want to opt for the Subaru option kinda cheating, but then
again it all comes down to the dollars we have to spend here in
Australia so as to get our Wasserboxer engines rebuiilt.
Why rebuild something if you can obtain more power for less and swap
to something that is still in mas production, I hate to say it but it
kinda makes sense.
Still throwing a Japanese Motor in a German Car???????????

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Mike" <borzeken@...> wrote:
>
> Hi les,
>
>
>
> Or when one wants more power but wants to keep it a volkswagen and not a
> vw-subaru mixture one ha sfour options :
>
>
>
> 1)Add a turbo and intercooler, a german company does so (Schick),
giving the
> DJ 163 hp and 280Nm torque, a south african company also did it
(turbovans I
> think they were called).
>
> 2) Add a compressor (supercharger), e.g. from a new Mini, but then start
> from an MV engine or, when starting from the DJ bring down the
compression
> ratio in the car first
>
> 3) Put in a 3.2 oettinger, it's basically the same as the DJ but
with two
> extra cylinders. (or the tuned version, the 3.7 oettinger
>
> 4) Last possibility, still VW original : put in an audi 2.5 or 2.6
like they
> did in the T3's they build till about a year or two ago. They also
stopped
> production of the Syncro in 1992 so that only two syncro's came
originally
> with this engine. But in the later T3's it became the standard thus
> replacing the waterboxer. There's an OEM bellhousing that makes you
bolt the
> audi engine right onto your gearbox
>
>
>
> For those who also see their cars as collectors items, changing it into
> Subaru is not an option. It's also not that easy but I agree it's a
great
> engine. But the other options are often forgotten, don't know why but
> according to me they are the way to go
>
>
>
>
>
> _____
>
> Van: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] Namens Les Harris
> Verzonden: donderdag 8 februari 2007 23:38
> Aan: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Onderwerp: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: 4.86 ratio
>
>
>
> The 2.1 is no ball of fire but that's what most of us use. There's
not a
> lot of point trying to up the power of it because the cost benefit
ratio is
> miniscule. The standard 2WD T3 has 4.86 and the Syncro runs quite
well on
> the same ratio. The wheel size comes into it, but it is the tyre
size that
> determines the revs per kilometre and in turn the distance
travelled, not
> the rim diameter on its own. You lose a bit of flexibility off road,
> particularly in the lower gears but it wouldn't bother a competent
driver.
> The 6+ ratios are strictly full time off road stuff. On normal
roads, they
> turn the Syncro into a mobile chicane. The Albins 3/4 gear set is of a
> higher ratio - higher road speed per 1000 RPM.
>
>
>
> If you want to significantly improve the power/torque, you should
consider
> going Subaru, particularly the 2.5. It costs, but worth it in the end.
> Several members of this group have done it.
>
>
>
> Remember that you will have to get a 2WD T3 speedo if you change the
front
> diff ratio.
>
>
>
> Les
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: syncrosity4now <mailto:syncrosity4now@...>
>
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com>
> @yahoogroups.com
>
> Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 10:59 PM
>
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: 4.86 ratio
>
>
>
> Yes i am aware of all this to a certain point, as for modifications to
> the enginre the only thig i may do at present is give throw on some
> 1.25 ratio rockers and a decent high flow cat and muffler system oh
> and som 4 prong spark plugs if i can find them(havent looked yet).
> So as to the gearbox i am hoping by keeping it relatively stock and
> keep it standard except for maybe for a heavy duty 3rd 4th. And at
> some stage a decent heavy duty diff set.
> So by matching my gearbox ratios and tyres and keeping it relatively
> stock i seem to be making some headway and choosing the right path. My
> motor is a 2.1ltr so i am fairly confident it will take the load of 15
> inch tyres and a 4.86 diff ratio. Not really caring about top speed as
> we all know it counts for nothing in the bush, so i am more so going
> for a finer balance.
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia
<mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> @yahoogroups.com, "Mike" <borzeken@> wrote:
>
>
>
> .
>
>
>
<http://geo.yahoo.com/serv?s=97359714/grpId=13267315/grpspId=1709926240/msgI
> d=1366/stime=1170935991/nc1=3848610/nc2=4025325/nc3=3>
>
18
Same problem.  Where do you get Go Westy spares in Australia?
 
If you averse to putting a rice burner into you Syncro, then a Porsche motor is the only alternative.
 
As I said, if you have unlimited money, then you have unlimited choices.  I don't have unlimited money so a Subaru is the only choice that represents value for money.
 
Les
 
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 6:48 PM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: adding power

Hey Mike i think u forgot Go Westy, these guys are still making the
wasserboxer style engine with options of 2.3, 2.5, and 2.7(?) not
quite sure on the last and they do a bloody good job, if only it
werent so pricey one may consider it. Oh and they also do the amped up
version of each motor, of course u can still rebuild the stock 2.1 or
other.
I think here in Aus Subaru option is taken because cost of rebuild vs
straight swap out.
If my motor goes Bang and throws a piston through case or other
terminal death.
I dont want to opt for the Subaru option kinda cheating, but then
again it all comes down to the dollars we have to spend here in
Australia so as to get our Wasserboxer engines rebuiilt.
Why rebuild something if you can obtain more power for less and swap
to something that is still in mas production, I hate to say it but it
kinda makes sense.
Still throwing a Japanese Motor in a German Car????????? ??

.

19
Yeh it goes without saying that the dollar shall dictate what happens
with replacement/rebuild...
As to the go westy option, i can tell u they use, i think it is a
Mexican cast block and cylinders. And produce their pistons and cams.
I know of a few T3's getting about with a subi motor, and at least
they are horizontally oppossed, in the same family.
Oh and who wouldnt love a porsche motor, i have thought the 944 option
if things west south and thats as far as i got. havent got any specs
or anything else and as for higher up the Porsche chain obviously
higher up the money.

I have said it before and will say it again, VW stuffed up as soon as
they went from T3-T4 and changed the whole thing. As if u were rivh
enough to burn money, why wouldnt have the T3 pfactory presses
re-established and start to pump them out again. Bloody idiots, for
as soon as they(VW) gave in and followed trends, a great breed was
squished and stamped out.....
Andrew


--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Les Harris"
<leslieharris@...> wrote:
>
> Same problem. Where do you get Go Westy spares in Australia?
>
> If you averse to putting a rice burner into you Syncro, then a
Porsche motor is the only alternative.
>
> As I said, if you have unlimited money, then you have unlimited
choices. I don't have unlimited money so a Subaru is the only choice
that represents value for money.
>
> Les
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: syncrosity4now
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 6:48 PM
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: adding power
>
>
> Hey Mike i think u forgot Go Westy, these guys are still making the
> wasserboxer style engine with options of 2.3, 2.5, and 2.7(?) not
> quite sure on the last and they do a bloody good job, if only it
> werent so pricey one may consider it. Oh and they also do the amped up
> version of each motor, of course u can still rebuild the stock 2.1 or
> other.
> I think here in Aus Subaru option is taken because cost of rebuild vs
> straight swap out.
> If my motor goes Bang and throws a piston through case or other
> terminal death.
> I dont want to opt for the Subaru option kinda cheating, but then
> again it all comes down to the dollars we have to spend here in
> Australia so as to get our Wasserboxer engines rebuiilt.
> Why rebuild something if you can obtain more power for less and swap
> to something that is still in mas production, I hate to say it but it
> kinda makes sense.
> Still throwing a Japanese Motor in a German Car???????????
>
>
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20

Sorry, yes i forgot the gowesty option. Very sorry about that as I think they make a very nice product which keeps the car still “vw original”. In fact I ordered a gowesty 2.4 to fit in my doka and already paid for it, including shipping from the us to Europe . There was just one little problem and that’s that I wanted guarantee on a setup they had no experience with : a 2.1 DJ to start with instead of an MV (they don’t know the 2.1DJ in the us, they only know the 1.9 as a DJ) and secondly I wanted to run it on LPG (liquefied petrol gas), as I was driving that before in my 2.1DJ. As they had no experience with this setup, very understandably they couldn’t give me any guarantee on the engine, although they thought it would do just fine. But I didn’t want to spend such an amount of money on an engine with no guarantee.

The guys from Gowesty were very understanding and very nice to deal with. They made no problem with paying me back my money.

 

Then a 3.2 six cylinder with 165HP and 260 Nm came up for sale in germany . This engine was only build for T3’s, developed by VW to a certain degree and then finished by Oettinger who commercialised it. I fell in love with this engine and put in my car ( www.wbx6.com ) . In my heavy 2.5 tonnes doka (when empty) which is lifted and runs on heavy profile tires it burns a lot of petrol, but on the other hand only 1 litre more per 100 km then when I had the 2.1 in it. But I don’t really mind since my orange doka is not a daily driver. Nevertheless I’d like to put it back on LPG later this year, which is very environment friendly and costs one third of the price of petrol here in Belgium .

 

But, again, there are more options to keep it a real vw (if one wants to). I like to look at what setup was produced by vw or one could order through vw. But don’t get me wrong, I love to read testimonials of all kinds of modifications and engine conversions.

Porsche does sound great too, and so does golf gti conversions (I have a 2wd doka gti for the moment), or a Syncro with a VR6 engine in it, also great J

 

So, putting a Japanese engine in a german car ? For me : no,  For other people : if it makes you happy you should do it, never mind what others say or think. But I guess most of us don’t care a lot of what the neighbours are thinking, right ?  J Hehehe

 

Mike plompen

 

Van: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com ] Namens syncrosity4now
Verzonden: vrijdag 9 februari 2007 8:49
Aan: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Onderwerp: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: adding power

 

Hey Mike i think u forgot Go Westy, these guys are still making the
wasserboxer style engine with options of 2.3, 2.5, and 2.7(?) not
quite sure on the last and they do a bloody good job, if only it
werent so pricey one may consider it. Oh and they also do the amped up
version of each motor, of course u can still rebuild the stock 2.1 or
other.
I think here in Aus Subaru option is taken because cost of rebuild vs
straight swap out.
If my motor goes Bang and throws a piston through case or other
terminal death.
I dont want to opt for the Subaru option kinda cheating, but then
again it all comes down to the dollars we have to spend here in
Australia so as to get our Wasserboxer engines rebuiilt.
Why rebuild something if you can obtain more power for less and swap
to something that is still in mas production, I hate to say it but it
kinda makes sense.
Still throwing a Japanese Motor in a German Car????????? ??

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com, "Mike" <borzeken@.. .> wrote:

>
> Hi les,
>
>
>
> Or when one wants more power but wants to keep it a volkswagen and not a
> vw-subaru mixture one ha sfour options :
>
>
>
> 1)Add a turbo and intercooler, a german company does so (Schick),
giving the
> DJ 163 hp and 280Nm torque, a south african company also did it
(turbovans I
> think they were called).
>
> 2) Add a compressor (supercharger) , e.g. from a new Mini, but then
start
> from an MV engine or, when starting from the DJ bring down the
compression
> ratio in the car first
>
> 3) Put in a 3.2 oettinger, it's basically the same as the DJ but
with two
> extra cylinders. (or the tuned version, the 3.7 oettinger
>
> 4) Last possibility, still VW original : put in an audi 2.5 or 2.6
like they
> did in the T3's they build till about a year or two ago. They also
stopped
> production of the Syncro in 1992 so that only two syncro's came
originally
> with this engine. But in the later T3's it became the standard thus
> replacing the waterboxer. There's an OEM bellhousing that makes you
bolt the
> audi engine right onto your gearbox
>
>
>
> For those who also see their cars as collectors items, changing it into
> Subaru is not an option. It's also not that easy but I agree it's a
great
> engine. But the other options are often forgotten, don't know why but
> according to me they are the way to go
>
>
>
>
>
> _____
>
> Van: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com]
Namens Les Harris
> Verzonden: donderdag 8 februari 2007 23:38
> Aan: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com
> Onderwerp: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Re: 4.86 ratio
>
>
>
> The 2.1 is no ball of fire but that's what most of us use. There's
not a
> lot of point trying to up the power of it because the cost benefit
ratio is
> miniscule. The standard 2WD T3 has 4.86 and the Syncro runs quite
well on
> the same ratio. The wheel size comes into it, but it is the tyre
size that
> determines the revs per kilometre and in turn the distance
travelled, not
> the rim diameter on its own. You lose a bit of flexibility off road,
> particularly in the lower gears but it wouldn't bother a competent
driver.
> The 6+ ratios are strictly full time off road stuff. On normal
roads, they
> turn the Syncro into a mobile chicane. The Albins 3/4 gear set is of a
> higher ratio - higher road speed per 1000 RPM.
>
>
>
> If you want to significantly improve the power/torque, you should
consider
> going Subaru, particularly the 2.5. It costs, but worth it in the end.
> Several members of this group have done it.
>
>
>
> Remember that you will have to get a 2WD T3 speedo if you change the
front
> diff ratio.
>
>
>
> Les
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: syncrosity4now <mailto:syncrosity4 now@...>
>
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia <mailto:
href="mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com">Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com>
> @yahoogroups. com
>
> Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 10:59 PM
>
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Re: 4.86 ratio
>
>
>
> Yes i am aware of all this to a certain point, as for modifications to
> the enginre the only thig i may do at present is give throw on some
> 1.25 ratio rockers and a decent high flow cat and muffler system oh
> and som 4 prong spark plugs if i can find them(havent looked yet).
> So as to the gearbox i am hoping by keeping it relatively stock and
> keep it standard except for maybe for a heavy duty 3rd 4th. And at
> some stage a decent heavy duty diff set.
> So by matching my gearbox ratios and tyres and keeping it relatively
> stock i seem to be making some headway and choosing the right path. My
> motor is a 2.1ltr so i am fairly confident it will take the load of 15
> inch tyres and a 4.86 diff ratio. Not really caring about top speed as
> we all know it counts for nothing in the bush, so i am more so going
> for a finer balance.
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia
<mailto:Syncro_ T3_Australia% 40yahoogroups. com>
> @yahoogroups. com, "Mike" <borzeken@> wrote:
>
>
>
> .
>
>
>
<http://geo.yahoo. com/serv? s=97359714/ grpId=13267315/ grpspId=17099262 40/msgI
> d=1366/stime= 1170935991/ nc1=3848610/ nc2=4025325/ nc3=3>
>