Prestige AC system

kiehn38 · 24 November 2011 22:19

Thanks Ben, I’ll gladly take it..!!!! Hartmut

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 10:06 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system

I have Prestidge AC,and I have the same AC vents as Yurik and Ken.
I hope to get my AC running before Xmas.Yuriks comments on his AC, has given me hope that one day,I may be able to drive in coolness and peacefulness(whingingless).
BTW,I have a Prestidge compressor if someone wants one.
BenC

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, Ken Garratt <unclekenz@...> wrote:
>
>
> My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are. Ken
>
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> From: gregespo73@...
> Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
> Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg E
> From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@...>
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
> Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> GregMy Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the NW.Yurik From:
> Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of greg esposito
> Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Ken, I have a "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw that he had a rear evap fitted. Does
> Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@...>
> To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
> Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Greg,I presently can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works
> well. I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ...... Ken,My syncro has the Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective.
> At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac. With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components
> remain.If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier. I would use Hose Masters/Enzed or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the components in the system are re-used i.e.,
> condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.I would then present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.My ac has remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks. For the moment I am keeping cool. Regards Yurik 21/11/2008 So thanks very much again Yurik.This leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd
> much appreciate it asap. TIA. Cheers.
> KenTo: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> From: gregespo73@...
> Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
> Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
>
> Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the
> plastic curtain. Greg E From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@...>
> To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system All, I am about to embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck. Please see the attached files re the new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely notable. Agreed?
> One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added to the system for other components during refurbishment? Putting the question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA. Cheers. Ken
>

bentbutstr8 · 24 November 2011 22:40

Hartis,

Most AC systems have a foam element in the condensation drip tray to keep water trapped there from sloshing around. Over the years, the foam comes loose and flies through the blower system. The most annoying time is when you turn the system on for the first time after a long period of non-use. Foam shooting out at your face while you're sweating in the heat. Bits of foam might find comfort sticking to the sweat on your face.;-)

BenT
sent from my electronic leash

On Nov 24, 2011, at 2:16 PM, "Hartmut Kiehn" <hartis@live.com.au> wrote:

Ken, you have seen mine 2 weeks ago, it is Prestige and has 3 vents and is taller than yours....I took the cover off the other day and found that the evaporator had some sort of foam cloth (pollen filter ?) installed at at the air exit side. I have taken that thing out as it (to me) doesn’t serve any other purpose then obstructing the airflow. Worx better now. Hartmut

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken Garratt
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 9:09 PM
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are.
Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg E

From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@iinet.net.au>
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg
My Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the NW.
Yurik

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of greg esposito
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken, I have a "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw that he had a rear evap fitted. Does Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg,
I presently can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works well.

I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ......

Ken,
My syncro has the Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective. At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components remain.
If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier.
I would use Hose Masters/Enzed or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the components in the system are re-used i.e., condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.
I would then present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.
My ac has remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks.
For the moment I am keeping cool.
Regards
Yurik 21/11/2008

So thanks very much again Yurik.
This leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd much appreciate it asap. TIA.

Cheers.

Ken
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the plastic curtain. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

All,

I am about to embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck.

Please see the attached files re the new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely notable. Agreed?

One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added to the system for other components during refurbishment?

Putting the question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA.

Cheers.

Ken

kiehn38 · 24 November 2011 22:53

BenT, thanks, have learnt something this morning ! We had the experience with the 96 Golf spitting out foam pieces everywhere.

As always , enjoying your contributions immensely.

Hartis (Hiwthi)

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of BenT Syncro
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 9:41 AM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Hartis,

Most AC systems have a foam element in the condensation drip tray to keep water trapped there from sloshing around. Over the years, the foam comes loose and flies through the blower system. The most annoying time is when you turn the system on for the first time after a long period of non-use. Foam shooting out at your face while you're sweating in the heat. Bits of foam might find comfort sticking to the sweat on your face.;-)

BenT
sent from my electronic leash

On Nov 24, 2011, at 2:16 PM, "Hartmut Kiehn" <hartis@live.com.au> wrote:

Ken, you have seen mine 2 weeks ago, it is Prestige and has 3 vents and is taller than yours....I took the cover off the other day and found that the evaporator had some sort of foam cloth (pollen filter ?) installed at at the air exit side. I have taken that thing out as it (to me) doesn’t serve any other purpose then obstructing the airflow. Worx better now. Hartmut

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken Garratt
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 9:09 PM
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are.
Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg E

From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@iinet.net.au>
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg
My Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the NW.
Yurik

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of greg esposito
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken, I have a "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw that he had a rear evap fitted. Does Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg,
I presently can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works well.

I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ......

Ken,
My syncro has the Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective. At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components remain.
If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier.
I would use Hose Masters/Enzed or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the components in the system are re-used i.e., condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.
I would then present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.
My ac has remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks.
For the moment I am keeping cool.
Regards
Yurik 21/11/2008

So thanks very much again Yurik.
This leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd much appreciate it asap. TIA.

Cheers.

Ken
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the plastic curtain. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

All,

I am about to embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck.

Please see the attached files re the new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely notable. Agreed?

One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added to the system for other components during refurbishment?

Putting the question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA.

Cheers.

Ken

bentbutstr8 · 24 November 2011 22:55

Ken,

Of the hundreds is Syncronauts and Vanagon pilots I have met personally, only Blake and one other fellow has installed such a system.

The Behr in-dash takes no more space in the interior than the back of glovebox (in LHD) and the spot where the radio resides. I don't even have wiring for the radio in my Syncro 16. I won't be missing the radio.

As for the underseat installation, it takes the space the size of a toaster oven. Space which I never use.

And as for people going to Death Valley, aficionados swear by the beauty of the night sky and the majesty of landscape during the day. To the majority of people, DV is just a place you have to drive through to get someplace else. They only see the giant thermometer at the appropriately named, "Baker" California. They have no idea what's just beyond the freeway. All I can say (and mind you, I am not a fan) is, Death Valley is easy to ridicule until you have experienced it for yourself.

Cheers,

BenT

sent from my aircon'd triple suite

On Nov 24, 2011, at 12:31 PM, Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com> wrote:

Ben,
Death Valley in summer I mean.
Ken

To: syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
From: unclekenz@hotmail.com
Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2011 07:28:11 +1100
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ben,

Just interesting. This link for me illustrates the sort of lengths you guys across the very big ditch are prepared to go to with your mind blowing array of retro fitted Vanagon mods.

Most OZ syncro campers would be flat out finding spare space to install front and rear combo systems, certainly not overhead, nor bare yet another considerable expense.

So at the end of the day, refurbishing what I already have on board is as far as I'm prepared to go, a case of reasonable compromise, especially given I prefer travelling mostly during the more pleasant Autumn and Spring. If the AC system wasn't there when I bought the beast, I wouldn't have bought it. As it is there, hence my preparedness to give it a go to refurbish. End of story.

Anyone who visits or lives in or near Death Valley has got to be some crazy kind of masochist!

Cheers.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: syncro@gmail.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 06:37:14 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

I know the author of this article personally. For someone who appears to prefer a stock or very near factory solution, I am quite amazed that Ken would suggest this type of system. Or perhaps you only point to it as interesting reading.

Fortunately for us in the US, there were several options. The oldest was the VW dealer add-in Behr in dash system. Then there was a virtual copy of the Behr in the form of DPD in-dash made in Texas. This was one situation where I felt the copy was better than the original. Both the Behr and DPD being specifically designed as an aftermarket install, both are much easier to retrofit than the factory AC systems. The DPD has the advantage of using standard round bulkhead fittings. The Behr uses a large brass unified fitting which is very difficult to fit even with the correct templates. I own both units and have compared them side by side. Both systems are essentially factory air in the engine compartment. It is only the evaporator and blower system which is different from the factory systems.

During one of my parts chases, I came upon what I thought was a NOS Behr in dash missing only the center vent. Upon. Closer examination, I discovered it was an underseat secondary evap/blower system. It's very nicely done and leave a factory appearance when installed properly. I suppose you can fit the in-dash system in tandem with this system. Should you decide to also add the factory rear evap/blower, it appears quite feasible to create an environment that polar bears and penguins would feel comfortable in even in the ambient temperatures common during the summer months in Death Valley, California. To put that into perspective, on one drive to Las Vegas, Nevada, I stopped by a gas station to tank up. The giant thermometer outside read 118F degrees. I pointed that out to one of the locals. His response was, "I know. Isn't great that it finally cooled down?"

Anyway, I feel the further you move away from the factory design (such as with Prestige), you are likely going to have to solve problems which has been solve some 20 years ago by people likely to be more competent than the typical shadetree mechanic.

Regards,

BenT

On Nov 24, 2011, at 5:05 AM, Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com> wrote:

Greg,
In case you haven't seen this attachment re Vanagon AC install .... interesting challenge!

Cheers.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg E

From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@iinet.net.au>To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PMSubject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg
My Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the NW.
Yurik

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of greg esposito
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.comSubject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken, I have a "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw that he had a rear evap fitted. Does Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PMSubject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg,
I presently can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works well.

I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ......

Ken,
My syncro has the Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective. At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components remain.
If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier.
I would use Hose Masters/Enzed or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the components in the system are re-used i.e., condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.
I would then present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.
My ac has remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks.
For the moment I am keeping cool.
Regards
Yurik 21/11/2008

So thanks very much again Yurik.
This leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd much appreciate it asap. TIA.

Cheers.

Ken
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.comDate: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the plastic curtain. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PMSubject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

All,

I am about to embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck.

Please see the attached files re the new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely notable. Agreed?

One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added to the system for other components during refurbishment?

Putting the question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA.

Cheers.

Ken

<Vanagon aftermarket AC install.doc>

unclekenz · 25 November 2011 02:35

Ben,

Been to DV.

Thankfully it was September.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: syncro@gmail.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 14:55:01 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken,

Of the hundreds is Syncronauts and Vanagon pilots I have met personally, only Blake and one other fellow has installed such a system.

The Behr in-dash takes no more space in the interior than the back of glovebox (in LHD) and the spot where the radio resides. I don't even have wiring for the radio in my Syncro 16. I won't be missing the radio.

As for the underseat installation, it takes the space the size of a toaster oven. Space which I never use.

And as for people going to Death Valley, aficionados swear by the beauty of the night sky and the majesty of landscape during the day. To the majority of people, DV is just a place you have to drive through to get someplace else. They only see the giant thermometer at the appropriately named, "Baker" California. They have no idea what's just beyond the freeway. All I can say (and mind you, I am not a fan) is, Death Valley is easy to ridicule until you have experienced it for yourself.

Cheers,

BenT

sent from my aircon'd triple suite

On Nov 24, 2011, at 12:31 PM, Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com> wrote:

Ben,
Death Valley in summer I mean.
Ken

To: syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
From: unclekenz@hotmail.com
Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2011 07:28:11 +1100
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ben,

Just interesting. This link for me illustrates the sort of lengths you guys across the very big ditch are prepared to go to with your mind blowing array of retro fitted Vanagon mods.

Most OZ syncro campers would be flat out finding spare space to install front and rear combo systems, certainly not overhead, nor bare yet another considerable expense.

So at the end of the day, refurbishing what I already have on board is as far as I'm prepared to go, a case of reasonable compromise, especially given I prefer travelling mostly during the more pleasant Autumn and Spring. If the AC system wasn't there when I bought the beast, I wouldn't have bought it. As it is there, hence my preparedness to give it a go to refurbish. End of story.

Anyone who visits or lives in or near Death Valley has got to be some crazy kind of masochist!

Cheers.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: syncro@gmail.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 06:37:14 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

I know the author of this article personally. For someone who appears to prefer a stock or very near factory solution, I am quite amazed that Ken would suggest this type of system. Or perhaps you only point to it as interesting reading.

Fortunately for us in the US, there were several options. The oldest was the VW dealer add-in Behr in dash system. Then there was a virtual copy of the Behr in the form of DPD in-dash made in Texas. This was one situation where I felt the copy was better than the original. Both the Behr and DPD being specifically designed as an aftermarket install, both are much easier to retrofit than the factory AC systems. The DPD has the advantage of using standard round bulkhead fittings. The Behr uses a large brass unified fitting which is very difficult to fit even with the correct templates. I own both units and have compared them side by side. Both systems are essentially factory air in the engine compartment. It is only the evaporator and blower system which is different from the factory systems.

During one of my parts chases, I came upon what I thought was a NOS Behr in dash missing only the center vent. Upon. Closer examination, I discovered it was an underseat secondary evap/blower system. It's very nicely done and leave a factory appearance when installed properly. I suppose you can fit the in-dash system in tandem with this system. Should you decide to also add the factory rear evap/blower, it appears quite feasible to create an environment that polar bears and penguins would feel comfortable in even in the ambient temperatures common during the summer months in Death Valley, California. To put that into perspective, on one drive to Las Vegas, Nevada, I stopped by a gas station to tank up. The giant thermometer outside read 118F degrees. I pointed that out to one of the locals. His response was, "I know. Isn't great that it finally cooled down?"

Anyway, I feel the further you move away from the factory design (such as with Prestige), you are likely going to have to solve problems which has been solve some 20 years ago by people likely to be more competent than the typical shadetree mechanic.

Regards,

BenT

On Nov 24, 2011, at 5:05 AM, Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com> wrote:

Greg,
In case you haven't seen this attachment re Vanagon AC install .... interesting challenge!

Cheers.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg E

From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@iinet.net.au>To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PMSubject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg
My Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the NW.
Yurik

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of greg esposito
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.comSubject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken, I have a "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw that he had a rear evap fitted. Does Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PMSubject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg,
I presently can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works well.

I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ......

Ken,
My syncro has the Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective. At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components remain.
If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier.
I would use Hose Masters/Enzed or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the components in the system are re-used i.e., condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.
I would then present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.
My ac has remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks.
For the moment I am keeping cool.
Regards
Yurik 21/11/2008

So thanks very much again Yurik.
This leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd much appreciate it asap. TIA.

Cheers.

Ken
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.comDate: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the plastic curtain. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PMSubject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

All,

I am about to embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck.

Please see the attached files re the new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely notable. Agreed?

One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added to the system for other components during refurbishment?

Putting the question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA.

Cheers.

Ken

<Vanagon aftermarket AC install.doc>

unclekenz · 25 November 2011 03:54

All,

Well the AC is now functioning, all work completed in 1.5 hours. But I accept it is early days still.

I now need to trial it for some time, see how it goes, check temp, check sight glass, try it on a hot day etc etc. It has dye added, so later I can have it rechecked for leaks etc etc.

Changing over to a modern compressor as i did, anyone worrying about the necessity of swapping out obsolete flare type to current O ring type AC hose fittings "in car" need worry no more ... as they say, it was a piece of piss getting the hose fittings changeover done and done easily. Just need to find the person with the right equipment.

I think it'd be be a useful exercise for all those here who have a working Prestige AC system to carry out a simple temp test using a thermometer held in place right up against (NOT inside) the left-side vent of the dash unit with the system on high on both temp and fan and report your best recent result here. Such real life information would help determine roughly what temp drop output is possible based on these results, gives all of us a best temp benchmark and hence some clue as to whether or not any further AC system investigation or servicing is worthwhile/needed. Any starters please? This is all about helping each other ok.

Cheers.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: hartis@live.com.au
Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2011 09:16:21 +1100
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken, you have seen mine 2 weeks ago, it is Prestige and has 3 vents and is taller than yours....I took the cover off the other day and found that the evaporator had some sort of foam cloth (pollen filter ?) installed at at the air exit side. I have taken that thing out as it (to me) doesn’t serve any other purpose then obstructing the airflow. Worx better now. Hartmut

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken Garratt
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 9:09 PM
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg E

From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@iinet.net.au>
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg

My Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the NW.

Yurik

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of greg esposito
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken, I have a "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw that he had a rear evap fitted. Does Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg,

I presently can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works well.

I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ......

Ken,

My syncro has the Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective. At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.

With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components remain.

If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier.

I would use Hose Masters/Enzed or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the components in the system are re-used i.e., condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.

I would then present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.

My ac has remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks.

For the moment I am keeping cool.

Regards

Yurik 21/11/2008

So thanks very much again Yurik.

This leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd much appreciate it asap. TIA.

Cheers.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the plastic curtain. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

All,

I am about to embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck.

Please see the attached files re the new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely notable. Agreed?

One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added to the system for other components during refurbishment?

Putting the question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA.

Cheers.

Ken

gregespo73 · 25 November 2011 04:14

Ken, you should be able to use the thermostat knob to get the vent temp a couple degrees above freezing. If you feel it go warm and then cold again it has frozen up, so go hotter. Usually you can hear the thermostat cutting the clutch in and out. The clutch will usually cut in roughly between 5-7c and cut out between 1-4c. It can be a fine adjustment and also worth driving with the thermometer at the vent as sometimes after adjusting it stationary it will freeze on the road due to the increased air flow. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 2:54 PM
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

All,

Well the AC is now functioning, all work completed in 1.5 hours. But I accept it is early days still.

I now need to trial it for some time, see how it goes, check temp, check sight glass, try it on a hot day etc etc. It has dye added, so later I can have it rechecked for leaks etc etc.

Changing over to a modern compressor as i did, anyone worrying about the necessity of swapping out obsolete flare type to current O ring type AC hose fittings "in car" need worry no more ... as they say, it was a piece of piss getting the hose fittings changeover done and done easily. Just need to find the person with the right equipment.

I think it'd be be a useful exercise for all those here who have a working Prestige AC system to carry out a simple temp test using a thermometer held in place right up against (NOT inside) the left-side vent of the dash unit with the system on high on both temp and fan and report your best recent result here. Such real life information would help determine roughly what temp drop output is possible based on these results, gives all of us a best temp benchmark and hence some clue as to whether or not any further AC system investigation or servicing is worthwhile/needed. Any starters please? This is all about helping each other ok.

Cheers.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: hartis@live.com.au
Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2011 09:16:21 +1100
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken, you have seen mine 2 weeks ago, it is Prestige and has 3 vents and is taller than yours....I took the cover off the other day and found that the evaporator had some sort of foam cloth (pollen filter ?) installed at at the air exit side. I have taken that thing out as it (to me) doesn’t serve any other purpose then obstructing the airflow. Worx better now. Hartmut

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken Garratt
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 9:09 PM
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg E

From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@iinet.net.au>
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg

My Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the NW.

Yurik

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of greg esposito
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken, I have a "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw that he had a rear evap fitted. Does Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg,

I presently can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works well.

I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ......

Ken,

My syncro has the Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective. At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.

With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components remain.

If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier.

I would use Hose Masters/Enzed or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the components in the system are re-used i.e., condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.

I would then present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.

My ac has remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks.

For the moment I am keeping cool.

Regards

Yurik 21/11/2008

So thanks very much again Yurik.

This leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd much appreciate it asap. TIA.

Cheers.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the plastic curtain. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

All,

I am about to embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck.

Please see the attached files re the new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely notable. Agreed?

One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added to the system for other components during refurbishment?

Putting the question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA.

Cheers.

Ken

bentbutstr8 · 25 November 2011 04:31

With an excess of 3 million acres, I hope you wandered around more than a few well traveled roads. That's more space than some countries. Difficult to get the full flavour in one visit.

BenT

sent from my electronic leash

On Nov 24, 2011, at 6:35 PM, Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com> wrote:

Ben,
Been to DV.
Thankfully it was September.
Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: syncro@gmail.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 14:55:01 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken,

Of the hundreds is Syncronauts and Vanagon pilots I have met personally, only Blake and one other fellow has installed such a system.

The Behr in-dash takes no more space in the interior than the back of glovebox (in LHD) and the spot where the radio resides. I don't even have wiring for the radio in my Syncro 16. I won't be missing the radio.

As for the underseat installation, it takes the space the size of a toaster oven. Space which I never use.

And as for people going to Death Valley, aficionados swear by the beauty of the night sky and the majesty of landscape during the day. To the majority of people, DV is just a place you have to drive through to get someplace else. They only see the giant thermometer at the appropriately named, "Baker" California. They have no idea what's just beyond the freeway. All I can say (and mind you, I am not a fan) is, Death Valley is easy to ridicule until you have experienced it for yourself.

Cheers,

BenT

sent from my aircon'd triple suite

On Nov 24, 2011, at 12:31 PM, Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com> wrote:

Ben,
Death Valley in summer I mean.
Ken

To: syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
From: unclekenz@hotmail.com
Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2011 07:28:11 +1100
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ben,

Just interesting. This link for me illustrates the sort of lengths you guys across the very big ditch are prepared to go to with your mind blowing array of retro fitted Vanagon mods.

Most OZ syncro campers would be flat out finding spare space to install front and rear combo systems, certainly not overhead, nor bare yet another considerable expense.

So at the end of the day, refurbishing what I already have on board is as far as I'm prepared to go, a case of reasonable compromise, especially given I prefer travelling mostly during the more pleasant Autumn and Spring. If the AC system wasn't there when I bought the beast, I wouldn't have bought it. As it is there, hence my preparedness to give it a go to refurbish. End of story.

Anyone who visits or lives in or near Death Valley has got to be some crazy kind of masochist!

Cheers.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: syncro@gmail.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 06:37:14 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

I know the author of this article personally. For someone who appears to prefer a stock or very near factory solution, I am quite amazed that Ken would suggest this type of system. Or perhaps you only point to it as interesting reading.

Fortunately for us in the US, there were several options. The oldest was the VW dealer add-in Behr in dash system. Then there was a virtual copy of the Behr in the form of DPD in-dash made in Texas. This was one situation where I felt the copy was better than the original. Both the Behr and DPD being specifically designed as an aftermarket install, both are much easier to retrofit than the factory AC systems. The DPD has the advantage of using standard round bulkhead fittings. The Behr uses a large brass unified fitting which is very difficult to fit even with the correct templates. I own both units and have compared them side by side. Both systems are essentially factory air in the engine compartment. It is only the evaporator and blower system which is different from the factory systems.

During one of my parts chases, I came upon what I thought was a NOS Behr in dash missing only the center vent. Upon. Closer examination, I discovered it was an underseat secondary evap/blower system. It's very nicely done and leave a factory appearance when installed properly. I suppose you can fit the in-dash system in tandem with this system. Should you decide to also add the factory rear evap/blower, it appears quite feasible to create an environment that polar bears and penguins would feel comfortable in even in the ambient temperatures common during the summer months in Death Valley, California. To put that into perspective, on one drive to Las Vegas, Nevada, I stopped by a gas station to tank up. The giant thermometer outside read 118F degrees. I pointed that out to one of the locals. His response was, "I know. Isn't great that it finally cooled down?"

Anyway, I feel the further you move away from the factory design (such as with Prestige), you are likely going to have to solve problems which has been solve some 20 years ago by people likely to be more competent than the typical shadetree mechanic.

Regards,

BenT

On Nov 24, 2011, at 5:05 AM, Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com> wrote:

Greg,
In case you haven't seen this attachment re Vanagon AC install .... interesting challenge!

Cheers.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg E

From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@iinet.net.au>To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PMSubject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg
My Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the NW.
Yurik

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of greg esposito
Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.comSubject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken, I have a "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw that he had a rear evap fitted. Does Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PMSubject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg,
I presently can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works well.

I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ......

Ken,
My syncro has the Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective. At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components remain.
If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier.
I would use Hose Masters/Enzed or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the components in the system are re-used i.e., condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.
I would then present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.
My ac has remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks.
For the moment I am keeping cool.
Regards
Yurik 21/11/2008

So thanks very much again Yurik.
This leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd much appreciate it asap. TIA.

Cheers.

Ken
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.comDate: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the plastic curtain. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PMSubject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

All,

I am about to embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck.

Please see the attached files re the new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely notable. Agreed?

One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added to the system for other components during refurbishment?

Putting the question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA.

Cheers.

Ken

<Vanagon aftermarket AC install.doc>

bencroft96 · 25 November 2011 07:47

Hart,its all yours.See you soon.
BenC

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Hartmut Kiehn" <hartis@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Ben, I'll gladly take it..!!!! Hartmut
>
>
>
> From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
> Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 10:06 PM
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system
>
>
>
>
>
> I have Prestidge AC,and I have the same AC vents as Yurik and Ken.
> I hope to get my AC running before Xmas.Yuriks comments on his AC, has given
> me hope that one day,I may be able to drive in coolness and
> peacefulness(whingingless).
> BTW,I have a Prestidge compressor if someone wants one.
> BenC
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> , Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in
> other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are. Ken
> >
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > From: gregespo73@
> > Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the
> cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it
> brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the
> vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg
> E
> > From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@>
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > GregMy Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of
> the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the
> unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the
> NW.Yurik From:
> > Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of greg esposito
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Ken, I have a
> "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air
> temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my
> system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not
> enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw
> that he had a rear evap fitted. Does
> > Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the
> original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash
> next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I
> have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge
> vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air
> leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers
> why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project
> just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need
> to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E
> From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Greg,I presently
> can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind
> the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works
> > well. I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed
> post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ...... Ken,My syncro has the
> Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective.
> > At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and
> this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine
> conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro
> fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold
> air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old
> compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an
> aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a
> 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
> With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new
> hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components
> > remain.If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the
> existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The
> remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the
> compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier. I would use Hose Masters/Enzed
> or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the
> result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al
> tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the
> components in the system are re-used i.e.,
> > condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.I would then
> present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a
> re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and
> contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum
> leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in
> the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for
> leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after
> approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.My ac has
> remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow
> reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion
> of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks. For the moment I am
> keeping cool. Regards Yurik 21/11/2008 So thanks very much again Yurik.This
> leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if
> anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd
> > much appreciate it asap. TIA. Cheers.
> > KenTo: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > From: gregespo73@
> > Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> > Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an
> additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and
> fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash
> thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive
> duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you
> probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the
> > plastic curtain. Greg E From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
> > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system All, I am about to
> embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system
> in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck. Please see the attached files re the
> new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well
> as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these
> Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely
> notable. Agreed?
> > One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the
> new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added
> to the system for other components during refurbishment? Putting the
> question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any
> new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was
> added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for
> the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA. Cheers. Ken
> >
>

stevemullervw · 25 November 2011 07:55

The other supplier with the taller vents is a auto frost system, these guys still exist and still retro fit units into T3’s at Milperra ask for Geoff Thomas, I suggest to try and use an over head unit as the dash units are VERY noisy and have a less than desirable air flow in comparison. Cheers steve

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 6:48 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system

Hart,its all yours.See you soon.
BenC

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Hartmut Kiehn" <hartis@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Ben, I'll gladly take it..!!!! Hartmut
>
>
>
> From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
> Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 10:06 PM
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system
>
>
>
>
>
> I have Prestidge AC,and I have the same AC vents as Yurik and Ken.
> I hope to get my AC running before Xmas.Yuriks comments on his AC, has given
> me hope that one day,I may be able to drive in coolness and
> peacefulness(whingingless).
> BTW,I have a Prestidge compressor if someone wants one.
> BenC
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> , Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in
> other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are. Ken
> >
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > From: gregespo73@
> > Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the
> cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it
> brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the
> vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg
> E
> > From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@>
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > GregMy Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of
> the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the
> unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the
> NW.Yurik From:
> > Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of greg esposito
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Ken, I have a
> "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air
> temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my
> system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not
> enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw
> that he had a rear evap fitted. Does
> > Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the
> original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash
> next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I
> have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge
> vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air
> leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers
> why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project
> just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need
> to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E
> From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Greg,I presently
> can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind
> the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works
> > well. I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed
> post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ...... Ken,My syncro has the
> Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective.
> > At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and
> this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine
> conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro
> fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold
> air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old
> compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an
> aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a
> 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
> With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new
> hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components
> > remain.If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the
> existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The
> remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the
> compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier. I would use Hose Masters/Enzed
> or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the
> result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al
> tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the
> components in the system are re-used i.e.,
> > condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.I would then
> present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a
> re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and
> contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum
> leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in
> the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for
> leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after
> approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.My ac has
> remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow
> reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion
> of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks. For the moment I am
> keeping cool. Regards Yurik 21/11/2008 So thanks very much again Yurik.This
> leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if
> anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd
> > much appreciate it asap. TIA. Cheers.
> > KenTo: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > From: gregespo73@
> > Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> > Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an
> additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and
> fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash
> thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive
> duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you
> probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the
> > plastic curtain. Greg E From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
> > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system All, I am about to
> embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system
> in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck. Please see the attached files re the
> new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well
> as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these
> Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely
> notable. Agreed?
> > One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the
> new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added
> to the system for other components during refurbishment? Putting the
> question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any
> new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was
> added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for
> the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA. Cheers. Ken
> >
>

kiehn38 · 25 November 2011 08:10

Stephan, But most of us got Kampers, how to go about an o/head unit ?? Hart

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Muller - Kombi Rescue
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 6:55 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system

The other supplier with the taller vents is a auto frost system, these guys still exist and still retro fit units into T3’s at Milperra ask for Geoff Thomas, I suggest to try and use an over head unit as the dash units are VERY noisy and have a less than desirable air flow in comparison. Cheers steve

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 6:48 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system

Hart,its all yours.See you soon.
BenC

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Hartmut Kiehn" <hartis@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Ben, I'll gladly take it..!!!! Hartmut
>
>
>
> From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
> Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 10:06 PM
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system
>
>
>
>
>
> I have Prestidge AC,and I have the same AC vents as Yurik and Ken.
> I hope to get my AC running before Xmas.Yuriks comments on his AC, has given
> me hope that one day,I may be able to drive in coolness and
> peacefulness(whingingless).
> BTW,I have a Prestidge compressor if someone wants one.
> BenC
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> , Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in
> other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are. Ken
> >
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > From: gregespo73@
> > Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the
> cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it
> brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the
> vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg
> E
> > From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@>
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > GregMy Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of
> the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the
> unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the
> NW.Yurik From:
> > Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of greg esposito
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Ken, I have a
> "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air
> temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my
> system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not
> enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw
> that he had a rear evap fitted. Does
> > Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the
> original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash
> next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I
> have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge
> vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air
> leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers
> why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project
> just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need
> to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E
> From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Greg,I presently
> can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind
> the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works
> > well. I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed
> post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ...... Ken,My syncro has the
> Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective.
> > At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and
> this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine
> conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro
> fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold
> air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old
> compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an
> aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a
> 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
> With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new
> hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components
> > remain.If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the
> existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The
> remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the
> compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier. I would use Hose Masters/Enzed
> or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the
> result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al
> tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the
> components in the system are re-used i.e.,
> > condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.I would then
> present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a
> re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and
> contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum
> leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in
> the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for
> leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after
> approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.My ac has
> remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow
> reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion
> of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks. For the moment I am
> keeping cool. Regards Yurik 21/11/2008 So thanks very much again Yurik.This
> leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if
> anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd
> > much appreciate it asap. TIA. Cheers.
> > KenTo: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > From: gregespo73@
> > Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> > Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an
> additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and
> fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash
> thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive
> duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you
> probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the
> > plastic curtain. Greg E From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
> > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system All, I am about to
> embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system
> in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck. Please see the attached files re the
> new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well
> as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these
> Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely
> notable. Agreed?
> > One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the
> new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added
> to the system for other components during refurbishment? Putting the
> question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any
> new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was
> added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for
> the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA. Cheers. Ken
> >
>

kiehn38 · 25 November 2011 08:13

Hope that the rains stop by then, Had 160mm last 2 days and it’s not stopping yet. Hart

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 6:48 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system

Hart,its all yours.See you soon.
BenC

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Hartmut Kiehn" <hartis@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Ben, I'll gladly take it..!!!! Hartmut
>
>
>
> From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
> Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 10:06 PM
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system
>
>
>
>
>
> I have Prestidge AC,and I have the same AC vents as Yurik and Ken.
> I hope to get my AC running before Xmas.Yuriks comments on his AC, has given
> me hope that one day,I may be able to drive in coolness and
> peacefulness(whingingless).
> BTW,I have a Prestidge compressor if someone wants one.
> BenC
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> , Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in
> other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are. Ken
> >
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > From: gregespo73@
> > Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the
> cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it
> brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the
> vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg
> E
> > From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@>
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > GregMy Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of
> the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the
> unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the
> NW.Yurik From:
> > Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of greg esposito
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Ken, I have a
> "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air
> temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my
> system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not
> enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw
> that he had a rear evap fitted. Does
> > Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the
> original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash
> next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I
> have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge
> vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air
> leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers
> why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project
> just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need
> to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E
> From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Greg,I presently
> can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind
> the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works
> > well. I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed
> post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ...... Ken,My syncro has the
> Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective.
> > At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and
> this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine
> conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro
> fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold
> air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old
> compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an
> aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a
> 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
> With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new
> hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components
> > remain.If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the
> existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The
> remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the
> compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier. I would use Hose Masters/Enzed
> or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the
> result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al
> tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the
> components in the system are re-used i.e.,
> > condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.I would then
> present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a
> re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and
> contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum
> leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in
> the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for
> leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after
> approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.My ac has
> remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow
> reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion
> of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks. For the moment I am
> keeping cool. Regards Yurik 21/11/2008 So thanks very much again Yurik.This
> leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if
> anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd
> > much appreciate it asap. TIA. Cheers.
> > KenTo: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > From: gregespo73@
> > Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> > Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an
> additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and
> fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash
> thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive
> duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you
> probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the
> > plastic curtain. Greg E From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
> > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system All, I am about to
> embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system
> in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck. Please see the attached files re the
> new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well
> as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these
> Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely
> notable. Agreed?
> > One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the
> new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added
> to the system for other components during refurbishment? Putting the
> question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any
> new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was
> added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for
> the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA. Cheers. Ken
> >
>

stevemullervw · 25 November 2011 08:20

Hart, what you can use is the Tarago style system which can be bought new and is very slim with control unit and fans all neat and tidy....we have one mounted in a split screen bus just behind the driver....the biggest problem is Trakka style roof will only allow a unit fitted right up the back...and the camperise roof will cause moving between the front cab and rear a slight issue. Having cold air fall down is better than it blasted at your face, maybe Goeff has a better solution at autofrost...ps air con brackets are plentiful in the states and I brought back about 4 cost me about $50 ea and worth every cent.

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Hartmut Kiehn
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 7:11 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system

Stephan, But most of us got Kampers, how to go about an o/head unit ?? Hart

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Muller - Kombi Rescue
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 6:55 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system

The other supplier with the taller vents is a auto frost system, these guys still exist and still retro fit units into T3’s at Milperra ask for Geoff Thomas, I suggest to try and use an over head unit as the dash units are VERY noisy and have a less than desirable air flow in comparison. Cheers steve

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 6:48 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system

Hart,its all yours.See you soon.
BenC

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Hartmut Kiehn" <hartis@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Ben, I'll gladly take it..!!!! Hartmut
>
>
>
> From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
> Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 10:06 PM
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system
>
>
>
>
>
> I have Prestidge AC,and I have the same AC vents as Yurik and Ken.
> I hope to get my AC running before Xmas.Yuriks comments on his AC, has given
> me hope that one day,I may be able to drive in coolness and
> peacefulness(whingingless).
> BTW,I have a Prestidge compressor if someone wants one.
> BenC
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> , Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in
> other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are. Ken
> >
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > From: gregespo73@
> > Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the
> cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it
> brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the
> vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg
> E
> > From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@>
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > GregMy Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of
> the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the
> unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the
> NW.Yurik From:
> > Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of greg esposito
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Ken, I have a
> "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air
> temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my
> system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not
> enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw
> that he had a rear evap fitted. Does
> > Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the
> original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash
> next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I
> have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge
> vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air
> leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers
> why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project
> just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need
> to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E
> From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Greg,I presently
> can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind
> the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works
> > well. I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed
> post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ...... Ken,My syncro has the
> Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective.
> > At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and
> this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine
> conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro
> fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold
> air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old
> compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an
> aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a
> 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
> With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new
> hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components
> > remain.If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the
> existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The
> remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the
> compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier. I would use Hose Masters/Enzed
> or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the
> result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al
> tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the
> components in the system are re-used i.e.,
> > condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.I would then
> present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a
> re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and
> contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum
> leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in
> the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for
> leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after
> approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.My ac has
> remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow
> reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion
> of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks. For the moment I am
> keeping cool. Regards Yurik 21/11/2008 So thanks very much again Yurik.This
> leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if
> anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd
> > much appreciate it asap. TIA. Cheers.
> > KenTo: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > From: gregespo73@
> > Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> > Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an
> additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and
> fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash
> thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive
> duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you
> probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the
> > plastic curtain. Greg E From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
> > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system All, I am about to
> embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system
> in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck. Please see the attached files re the
> new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well
> as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these
> Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely
> notable. Agreed?
> > One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the
> new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added
> to the system for other components during refurbishment? Putting the
> question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any
> new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was
> added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for
> the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA. Cheers. Ken
> >
>

bencroft96 · 25 November 2011 08:22

Hart,I have been holidaying in Hat Head now for about 15 years.
Every year it rains for some of the time.
I am hoping for a repeat of two years ago,when Point Plomer road was under water.Last year,it was dry, I did it in 2WD.Will make it more interesting for Skot and I on the way down to your place.
BenC

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Hartmut Kiehn" <hartis@...> wrote:
>
> Hope that the rains stop by then, Had 160mm last 2 days and it's not
> stopping yet. Hart
>
>
>
> From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
> Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 6:48 PM
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system
>
>
>
>
>
> Hart,its all yours.See you soon.
> BenC
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> , "Hartmut Kiehn"
> <hartis@> wrote:
> >
> > Thanks Ben, I'll gladly take it..!!!! Hartmut
> >
> >
> >
> > From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of Ben
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 10:06 PM
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I have Prestidge AC,and I have the same AC vents as Yurik and Ken.
> > I hope to get my AC running before Xmas.Yuriks comments on his AC, has
> given
> > me hope that one day,I may be able to drive in coolness and
> > peacefulness(whingingless).
> > BTW,I have a Prestidge compressor if someone wants one.
> > BenC
> >
> > --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> , Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in
> > other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are. Ken
> > >
> > > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > From: gregespo73@
> > > Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
> > > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does
> the
> > cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it
> > brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the
> > vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had.
> Greg
> > E
> > > From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@>
> > > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
> > > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > GregMy Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of
> > the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the
> > unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the
> > NW.Yurik From:
> > > Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of greg
> esposito
> > > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
> > > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Ken, I have a
> > "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air
> > temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my
> > system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not
> > enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw
> > that he had a rear evap fitted. Does
> > > Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs
> the
> > original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the
> dash
> > next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also
> I
> > have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and
> fridge
> > vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these
> air
> > leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear
> passengers
> > why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your
> project
> > just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may
> need
> > to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg
> E
> > From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
> > > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Greg,I presently
> > can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind
> > the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works
> > > well. I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a
> detailed
> > post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ...... Ken,My syncro has the
> > Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective.
> > > At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and
> > this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru
> engine
> > conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro
> > fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp
> cold
> > air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old
> > compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an
> > aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in
> a
> > 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
> > With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and
> new
> > hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other
> components
> > > remain.If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the
> > existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The
> > remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the
> > compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier. I would use Hose
> Masters/Enzed
> > or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as
> the
> > result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al
> > tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the
> > components in the system are re-used i.e.,
> > > condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.I would
> then
> > present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a
> > re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and
> > contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a
> vacuum
> > leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses
> in
> > the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A
> for
> > leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after
> > approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.My ac has
> > remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow
> > reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular
> diffusion
> > of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks. For the moment I
> am
> > keeping cool. Regards Yurik 21/11/2008 So thanks very much again
> Yurik.This
> > leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if
> > anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd
> > > much appreciate it asap. TIA. Cheers.
> > > KenTo: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > From: gregespo73@
> > > Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
> > > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> > >
> > > Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an
> > additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size
> and
> > fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in
> dash
> > thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive
> > duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you
> > probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the
> > > plastic curtain. Greg E From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
> > > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system All, I am about to
> > embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system
> > in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck. Please see the attached files re
> the
> > new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as
> well
> > as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these
> > Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely
> > notable. Agreed?
> > > One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in
> the
> > new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is
> added
> > to the system for other components during refurbishment? Putting the
> > question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any
> > new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was
> > added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for
> > the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA. Cheers. Ken
> > >
> >
>

kiehn38 · 25 November 2011 08:49

Taragoo in my Volkswagen ??? Will rather try and fit the original evaporator/blower unit into the dash. That unit blows you over if you stand in front of it.... Will keep you posted. Hart

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Muller - Kombi Rescue
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 7:20 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system

Hart, what you can use is the Tarago style system which can be bought new and is very slim with control unit and fans all neat and tidy....we have one mounted in a split screen bus just behind the driver....the biggest problem is Trakka style roof will only allow a unit fitted right up the back...and the camperise roof will cause moving between the front cab and rear a slight issue. Having cold air fall down is better than it blasted at your face, maybe Goeff has a better solution at autofrost...ps air con brackets are plentiful in the states and I brought back about 4 cost me about $50 ea and worth every cent.

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Hartmut Kiehn
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 7:11 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system

Stephan, But most of us got Kampers, how to go about an o/head unit ?? Hart

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Muller - Kombi Rescue
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 6:55 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system

The other supplier with the taller vents is a auto frost system, these guys still exist and still retro fit units into T3’s at Milperra ask for Geoff Thomas, I suggest to try and use an over head unit as the dash units are VERY noisy and have a less than desirable air flow in comparison. Cheers steve

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 6:48 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system

Hart,its all yours.See you soon.
BenC

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Hartmut Kiehn" <hartis@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Ben, I'll gladly take it..!!!! Hartmut
>
>
>
> From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
> Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 10:06 PM
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system
>
>
>
>
>
> I have Prestidge AC,and I have the same AC vents as Yurik and Ken.
> I hope to get my AC running before Xmas.Yuriks comments on his AC, has given
> me hope that one day,I may be able to drive in coolness and
> peacefulness(whingingless).
> BTW,I have a Prestidge compressor if someone wants one.
> BenC
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> , Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in
> other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are. Ken
> >
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > From: gregespo73@
> > Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does the
> cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it
> brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the
> vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had. Greg
> E
> > From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@>
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > GregMy Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of
> the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the
> unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the
> NW.Yurik From:
> > Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of greg esposito
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Ken, I have a
> "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air
> temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my
> system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not
> enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw
> that he had a rear evap fitted. Does
> > Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs the
> original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the dash
> next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also I
> have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and fridge
> vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these air
> leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear passengers
> why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your project
> just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may need
> to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg E
> From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Greg,I presently
> can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind
> the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works
> > well. I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a detailed
> post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ...... Ken,My syncro has the
> Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective.
> > At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and
> this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru engine
> conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro
> fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp cold
> air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old
> compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an
> aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in a
> 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
> With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and new
> hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other components
> > remain.If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the
> existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The
> remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the
> compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier. I would use Hose Masters/Enzed
> or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as the
> result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al
> tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the
> components in the system are re-used i.e.,
> > condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.I would then
> present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a
> re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and
> contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a vacuum
> leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses in
> the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A for
> leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after
> approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.My ac has
> remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow
> reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular diffusion
> of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks. For the moment I am
> keeping cool. Regards Yurik 21/11/2008 So thanks very much again Yurik.This
> leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if
> anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd
> > much appreciate it asap. TIA. Cheers.
> > KenTo: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > From: gregespo73@
> > Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
> > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> >
> > Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an
> additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size and
> fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in dash
> thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive
> duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you
> probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the
> > plastic curtain. Greg E From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
> > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system All, I am about to
> embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system
> in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck. Please see the attached files re the
> new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as well
> as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these
> Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely
> notable. Agreed?
> > One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in the
> new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is added
> to the system for other components during refurbishment? Putting the
> question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any
> new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was
> added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for
> the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA. Cheers. Ken
> >
>

kombi4x427lc · 25 November 2011 08:59

Ben,

Last year we went up the Point Plommer Rd just after heavy rain and the craters were full of water with water up to the top of the wheels in the worst ponds.

I think that is why my optical sensor went prematurerly.

It must have had a magic dry out over that period between my traverse and yours.

Even an 80 series Landcruiser died in a pond.

See U up there very soon.

Cheers,

Skot

----- Original Message -----

From: Ben

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Friday, November 25, 2011 7:22 PM

Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system

Hart,I have been holidaying in Hat Head now for about 15 years.
Every year it rains for some of the time.
I am hoping for a repeat of two years ago,when Point Plomer road was under water.Last year,it was dry, I did it in 2WD.Will make it more interesting for Skot and I on the way down to your place.
BenC

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Hartmut Kiehn" <hartis@...> wrote:
>
> Hope that the rains stop by then, Had 160mm last 2 days and it's not
> stopping yet. Hart
>
>
>
> From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
> Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 6:48 PM
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system
>
>
>
>
>
> Hart,its all yours.See you soon.
> BenC
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> , "Hartmut Kiehn"
> <hartis@> wrote:
> >
> > Thanks Ben, I'll gladly take it..!!!! Hartmut
> >
> >
> >
> > From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of Ben
> > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 10:06 PM
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I have Prestidge AC,and I have the same AC vents as Yurik and Ken.
> > I hope to get my AC running before Xmas.Yuriks comments on his AC, has
> given
> > me hope that one day,I may be able to drive in coolness and
> > peacefulness(whingingless).
> > BTW,I have a Prestidge compressor if someone wants one.
> > BenC
> >
> > --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> , Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in
> > other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are. Ken
> > >
> > > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > From: gregespo73@
> > > Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
> > > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does
> the
> > cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it
> > brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the
> > vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had.
> Greg
> > E
> > > From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@>
> > > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
> > > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > GregMy Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of
> > the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the
> > unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the
> > NW.Yurik From:
> > > Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of greg
> esposito
> > > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
> > > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Ken, I have a
> > "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air
> > temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my
> > system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not
> > enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw
> > that he had a rear evap fitted. Does
> > > Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs
> the
> > original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the
> dash
> > next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also
> I
> > have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and
> fridge
> > vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these
> air
> > leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear
> passengers
> > why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your
> project
> > just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may
> need
> > to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg
> E
> > From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
> > > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Greg,I presently
> > can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind
> > the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works
> > > well. I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a
> detailed
> > post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ...... Ken,My syncro has the
> > Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective.
> > > At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and
> > this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru
> engine
> > conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro
> > fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp
> cold
> > air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old
> > compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an
> > aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in
> a
> > 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
> > With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and
> new
> > hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other
> components
> > > remain.If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the
> > existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The
> > remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the
> > compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier. I would use Hose
> Masters/Enzed
> > or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as
> the
> > result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al
> > tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the
> > components in the system are re-used i.e.,
> > > condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.I would
> then
> > present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a
> > re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and
> > contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a
> vacuum
> > leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses
> in
> > the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A
> for
> > leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after
> > approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.My ac has
> > remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow
> > reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular
> diffusion
> > of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks. For the moment I
> am
> > keeping cool. Regards Yurik 21/11/2008 So thanks very much again
> Yurik.This
> > leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if
> > anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd
> > > much appreciate it asap. TIA. Cheers.
> > > KenTo: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > From: gregespo73@
> > > Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
> > > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> > >
> > > Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an
> > additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size
> and
> > fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in
> dash
> > thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive
> > duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you
> > probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the
> > > plastic curtain. Greg E From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
> > > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system All, I am about to
> > embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system
> > in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck. Please see the attached files re
> the
> > new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as
> well
> > as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these
> > Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely
> > notable. Agreed?
> > > One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in
> the
> > new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is
> added
> > to the system for other components during refurbishment? Putting the
> > question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any
> > new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was
> > added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for
> > the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA. Cheers. Ken
> > >
> >
>

unclekenz · 25 November 2011 09:17

Greg,

Ok thanks for that, I'll be experimenting for a while, see how it goes.

So far I've only done a stationary thermometer check after I got home, right now though I have my doubts it'll pull down to the sort of low temps you are suggesting. Hence the query to other Prestige system users. Is yours a Prestige system?

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 20:14:00 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken, you should be able to use the thermostat knob to get the vent temp a couple degrees above freezing. If you feel it go warm and then cold again it has frozen up, so go hotter. Usually you can hear the thermostat cutting the clutch in and out. The clutch will usually cut in roughly between 5-7c and cut out between 1-4c. It can be a fine adjustment and also worth driving with the thermometer at the vent as sometimes after adjusting it stationary it will freeze on the road due to the increased air flow. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 2:54 PM
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

All,

Well the AC is now functioning, all work completed in 1.5 hours. But I accept it is early days still.

I now need to trial it for some time, see how it goes, check temp, check sight glass, try it on a hot day etc etc. It has dye added, so later I can have it rechecked for leaks etc etc.

Changing over to a modern compressor as i did, anyone worrying about the necessity of swapping out obsolete flare type to current O ring type AC hose fittings "in car" need worry no more ... as they say, it was a piece of piss getting the hose fittings changeover done and done easily. Just need to find the person with the right equipment.

I think it'd be be a useful exercise for all those here who have a working Prestige AC system to carry out a simple temp test using a thermometer held in place right up against (NOT inside) the left-side vent of the dash unit with the system on high on both temp and fan and report your best recent result here. Such real life information would help determine roughly what temp drop output is possible based on these results, gives all of us a best temp benchmark and hence some clue as to whether or not any further AC system investigation or servicing is worthwhile/needed. Any starters please? This is all about helping each other ok.

Cheers.

Ken

kiehn38 · 25 November 2011 09:25

Will check tomorrow, Ken.

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken Garratt
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 8:18 PM
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg,

Ok thanks for that, I'll be experimenting for a while, see how it goes.

So far I've only done a stationary thermometer check after I got home, right now though I have my doubts it'll pull down to the sort of low temps you are suggesting. Hence the query to other Prestige system users. Is yours a Prestige system?

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 20:14:00 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken, you should be able to use the thermostat knob to get the vent temp a couple degrees above freezing. If you feel it go warm and then cold again it has frozen up, so go hotter. Usually you can hear the thermostat cutting the clutch in and out. The clutch will usually cut in roughly between 5-7c and cut out between 1-4c. It can be a fine adjustment and also worth driving with the thermometer at the vent as sometimes after adjusting it stationary it will freeze on the road due to the increased air flow. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 2:54 PM
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

All,

Well the AC is now functioning, all work completed in 1.5 hours. But I accept it is early days still.

I now need to trial it for some time, see how it goes, check temp, check sight glass, try it on a hot day etc etc. It has dye added, so later I can have it rechecked for leaks etc etc.

Changing over to a modern compressor as i did, anyone worrying about the necessity of swapping out obsolete flare type to current O ring type AC hose fittings "in car" need worry no more ... as they say, it was a piece of piss getting the hose fittings changeover done and done easily. Just need to find the person with the right equipment.

I think it'd be be a useful exercise for all those here who have a working Prestige AC system to carry out a simple temp test using a thermometer held in place right up against (NOT inside) the left-side vent of the dash unit with the system on high on both temp and fan and report your best recent result here. Such real life information would help determine roughly what temp drop output is possible based on these results, gives all of us a best temp benchmark and hence some clue as to whether or not any further AC system investigation or servicing is worthwhile/needed. Any starters please? This is all about helping each other ok.

Cheers.

Ken

bencroft96 · 25 November 2011 11:03

Skot,yeah must dry out within a week or so.
If it stops raining,with the amount of traffic that pass through then,it must drain off quickly.
It was dry with small puddles the week after you.
BenC

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Mr Scott Pitcher" <spbconsulting@...> wrote:
>
> Ben,
>
> Last year we went up the Point Plommer Rd just after heavy rain and the craters were full of water with water up to the top of the wheels in the worst ponds.
>
> I think that is why my optical sensor went prematurerly.
>
> It must have had a magic dry out over that period between my traverse and yours.
>
> Even an 80 series Landcruiser died in a pond.
>
> See U up there very soon.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Skot
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Ben
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Friday, November 25, 2011 7:22 PM
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system
>
>
>
> Hart,I have been holidaying in Hat Head now for about 15 years.
> Every year it rains for some of the time.
> I am hoping for a repeat of two years ago,when Point Plomer road was under water.Last year,it was dry, I did it in 2WD.Will make it more interesting for Skot and I on the way down to your place.
> BenC
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Hartmut Kiehn" <hartis@> wrote:
> >
> > Hope that the rains stop by then, Had 160mm last 2 days and it's not
> > stopping yet. Hart
> >
> >
> >
> > From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben
> > Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 6:48 PM
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Hart,its all yours.See you soon.
> > BenC
> >
> > --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> , "Hartmut Kiehn"
> > <hartis@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Thanks Ben, I'll gladly take it..!!!! Hartmut
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of Ben
> > > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 10:06 PM
> > > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Prestige AC system
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I have Prestidge AC,and I have the same AC vents as Yurik and Ken.
> > > I hope to get my AC running before Xmas.Yuriks comments on his AC, has
> > given
> > > me hope that one day,I may be able to drive in coolness and
> > > peacefulness(whingingless).
> > > BTW,I have a Prestidge compressor if someone wants one.
> > > BenC
> > >
> > > --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> , Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > My on-dash unit looks the same as Yuriks. I have seen taller units in
> > > other syncros, don't know though what brand of install they are. Ken
> > > >
> > > > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > > From: gregespo73@
> > > > Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:51:07 -0800
> > > > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Thanks for chiming in Yurik. I thought you might have that vent. Does
> > the
> > > cabin temp come down as much as in a modern car? Or is it more like it
> > > brings it down to a bearable level? I might have a go at opening up the
> > > vents or adding one through the ashtray like the U.S. behr systems had.
> > Greg
> > > E
> > > > From: Yurik Orlowsky <yuriko@>
> > > > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 7:02 PM
> > > > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > GregMy Prestige ac probably has more air flow as the unit sits on top of
> > > the dash and has 5 vents blowing into the cabin. See attached photo of the
> > > unit, with red Kimberly dust in the vents from our recent trip to the
> > > NW.Yurik From:
> > > > Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of greg
> > esposito
> > > > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 2:25 PM
> > > > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Ken, I have a
> > > "modern" compressor. The system was retrofitted to r134a in 2008. The air
> > > temp is a constant 1-3 degrees at the vents. If there was a fault with my
> > > system it just would not cycle consistanty at this temp. There is just not
> > > enough air coming out to cool the cabin. Mark was telling me at the dotvw
> > > that he had a rear evap fitted. Does
> > > > Yurik/yourself have the big vent box on top of the dash? Mine employs
> > the
> > > original face vents plus only one extra face vent in the middle of the
> > dash
> > > next to the radio. It is possible Yuriks has more air flow than mine. Also
> > I
> > > have not made any attempt to seal the cabin (carbon monoxide vent and
> > fridge
> > > vent). I think alot of the cold air escapes or is diluted through these
> > air
> > > leaks. I think the curtain is a no brainer if you dont have rear
> > passengers
> > > why cool the rest of the cabin? I am not trying to put you off your
> > project
> > > just saying after you get your standard presige system working you may
> > need
> > > to do some extra work to make it comfortable in the cabin. Good luck. Greg
> > E
> > > From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > > > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > > > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 4:01 PM
> > > > Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system Greg,I presently
> > > can't agree with your contentions, except for the idea of a curtain behind
> > > the front seats. Graham Adams has installed one, apparently works
> > > > well. I'm happy to give the refurbishment a try, encouraged by a
> > detailed
> > > post in 2008 from Yurik in Perth, as follows ...... Ken,My syncro has the
> > > Prestige Auto Air system and I also found it to be ineffective.
> > > > At one point when a re-gas was needed, I had the XT valve replaced and
> > > this improved the cooling significantly. Later when I did the Subaru
> > engine
> > > conversion the new engine (2003) came with a compressor which was retro
> > > fitted to the existing system and this combination produced very crisp
> > cold
> > > air, a huge improvement. I have come to the conclusion that the old
> > > compressors are inefficient and the modern new ones are the answer to an
> > > aging ac system that we have. One of my friends replaced his compressor in
> > a
> > > 2L air cooled VW bus with a smaller modern one and it transformed his ac.
> > > With the T3, the engine compressor bracket would have to be modified and
> > new
> > > hose connectors installed to suit the compressor used. All other
> > components
> > > > remain.If you can get a new modern compressor that bolts straight on the
> > > existing bracket then that would be the major part of the ac upgrade. The
> > > remaining things are to get new fittings on the hoses to connect to the
> > > compressor, new TX valve and receiver-drier. I would use Hose
> > Masters/Enzed
> > > or similar to crimp on new o-ring connectors. Any decrease of length as
> > the
> > > result of cutting off the old fittings can be made up by using longer Al
> > > tails on the new fittings, all available off the shelf. The rest of the
> > > components in the system are re-used i.e.,
> > > > condenser, evaporator, thermostat, pressure switch and hoses.I would
> > then
> > > present the completed system to an ac specialist and ask them to do a
> > > re-gas. Make sure that the system is flushed to remove any R12, oil and
> > > contaminants. Have a pressure test using Nitrogen gas and as well, a
> > vacuum
> > > leak down test. Make sure they use extra oil because of the longer hoses
> > in
> > > the syncro. They will probably inject a UV sensitive dye with the R134A
> > for
> > > leak checking post re-gas. It would be a good idea to return to them after
> > > approx. 600km with good use of the ac for a further leak test.My ac has
> > > remained very cold now some 3yrs later. However one would expect a slow
> > > reduction of efficiency after 5yrs or so due to the slow molecular
> > diffusion
> > > of the gas through the long rubber hoses and seal leaks. For the moment I
> > am
> > > keeping cool. Regards Yurik 21/11/2008 So thanks very much again
> > Yurik.This
> > > leaves me then with my original questions the subject of this post, if
> > > anyone has something specific to add along those lines, I'd
> > > > much appreciate it asap. TIA. Cheers.
> > > > KenTo: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > <mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > > From: gregespo73@
> > > > Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2011 19:47:13 -0800
> > > > Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system
> > > >
> > > > Ken unless you are putting an air curtain behind the driver or an
> > > additional evaporator in the rear, save your money. The evaporator size
> > and
> > > fan capacity are just insufficient for a five metre long box. If the in
> > dash
> > > thing would have worked VW would have done it. Instead they put a massive
> > > duct from rear to front. I guess your lucky as from what I understand you
> > > probably won't have rear passengers which to me says go the
> > > > plastic curtain. Greg E From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@>
> > > > To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com
> > <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > <mailto:syncro_t3_australia%40yahoogroups.com> >
> > > > Sent: Thursday, 24 November 2011 1:06 PM
> > > > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system All, I am about to
> > > embark on the refurbishment of the erm ... "much loved" Prestige AC system
> > > in my syncro. Touch wood. Wish me luck. Please see the attached files re
> > the
> > > new Zexel compressor that will be swapped in for the 20yo Sanden 709 as
> > well
> > > as the pdf fluid volume spec files for Vanagon AC systems. I suspect these
> > > Vanagon fluid volumes are not relevant to our Prestige AC system, merely
> > > notable. Agreed?
> > > > One thing I am unsure of is, aside from the refrigerant oil already in
> > the
> > > new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil is
> > added
> > > to the system for other components during refurbishment? Putting the
> > > question another way, ignoring the refrigerant oil volume included in any
> > > new compressor, how much extra total volume of same refrigerant oil was
> > > added to the system for other components during assembly as specified for
> > > the original Oz Prestige AC system in our vans? TIA. Cheers. Ken
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

unclekenz · 25 November 2011 11:33

Yeah thanks for that Hartmut ... be great.

Any others? TIA.

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: hartis@live.com.au
Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2011 20:25:28 +1100
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Will check tomorrow, Ken.

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken Garratt
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 8:18 PM
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Greg,

Ok thanks for that, I'll be experimenting for a while, see how it goes.

So far I've only done a stationary thermometer check after I got home, right now though I have my doubts it'll pull down to the sort of low temps you are suggesting. Hence the query to other Prestige system users. Is yours a Prestige system?

Ken

To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
From: gregespo73@yahoo.com
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 20:14:00 -0800
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

Ken, you should be able to use the thermostat knob to get the vent temp a couple degrees above freezing. If you feel it go warm and then cold again it has frozen up, so go hotter. Usually you can hear the thermostat cutting the clutch in and out. The clutch will usually cut in roughly between 5-7c and cut out between 1-4c. It can be a fine adjustment and also worth driving with the thermometer at the vent as sometimes after adjusting it stationary it will freeze on the road due to the increased air flow. Greg E

From: Ken Garratt <unclekenz@hotmail.com>
To: _T3_Australia forum Syncro <syncro_t3_australia@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, 25 November 2011 2:54 PM
Subject: RE: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Prestige AC system

All,

Well the AC is now functioning, all work completed in 1.5 hours. But I accept it is early days still.

I now need to trial it for some time, see how it goes, check temp, check sight glass, try it on a hot day etc etc. It has dye added, so later I can have it rechecked for leaks etc etc.

Changing over to a modern compressor as i did, anyone worrying about the necessity of swapping out obsolete flare type to current O ring type AC hose fittings "in car" need worry no more ... as they say, it was a piece of piss getting the hose fittings changeover done and done easily. Just need to find the person with the right equipment.

I think it'd be be a useful exercise for all those here who have a working Prestige AC system to carry out a simple temp test using a thermometer held in place right up against (NOT inside) the left-side vent of the dash unit with the system on high on both temp and fan and report your best recent result here. Such real life information would help determine roughly what temp drop output is possible based on these results, gives all of us a best temp benchmark and hence some clue as to whether or not any further AC system investigation or servicing is worthwhile/needed. Any starters please? This is all about helping each other ok.

Cheers.

Ken