Where to get a New VC?

1

I’m new to the Syncro scene and need to replace my VC as the old one has gone hard.  Where should I start looking? Is there any one in Australia that is good for parts or should I be looking over seas?


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2
Michael,
 
There are varying degrees of 'going hard', and it is not always detrimental.  As the VC becomes more aggressive, it becomes noticeable when doing full lock turns on a grippy surface - like dry bitumen - and very noticeable in tight supermarket carparks.  In these circumstances, it pays to use the minimum speed possible to reduce the load on the whole driveline.
 
I have found that an aggressive VC actually improves cornering and braking grip.  A further side benefit of this is helping to distribute braking forces, particularly on wet roads, and giving an anti lock effect.
 
The ideal solution is to fit a decoupler, which allows you to decouple the drive to the front diff when parking but otherwise run full time in all wheel drive.
 
Les
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 5:03 PM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Where to get a New VC?

I’m new to the Syncro scene and need to replace my VC as the old one has gone hard.  Where should I start looking? Is there any one in Australia that is good for parts or should I be looking over seas?


Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.

3

From what I have read, and the little I can under stand.  I believe the VC has become very aggressive.  I have jacked up the back of the syncro placed 2” block under the front wheels and at idle it is tiring to crawl over the blocks.  Hence I have removed the centre driver shaft to prevent any drive line damage.  Are VC available or should I be looking for a decoupler.  If so where do I look for a decoupler?   



----- Original Message ----
From: Les Harris <leslieharris@optushome.com.au>
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 5:49:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Where to get a New VC?

Michael,
 
There are varying degrees of 'going hard', and it is not always detrimental.  As the VC becomes more aggressive, it becomes noticeable when doing full lock turns on a grippy surface - like dry bitumen - and very noticeable in tight supermarket carparks.  In these circumstances, it pays to use the minimum speed possible to reduce the load on the whole driveline.
 
I have found that an aggressive VC actually improves cornering and braking grip.  A further side benefit of this is helping to distribute braking forces, particularly on wet roads, and giving an anti lock effect.
 
The ideal solution is to fit a decoupler, which allows you to decouple the drive to the front diff when parking but otherwise run full time in all wheel drive.
 
Les
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 5:03 PM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Where to get a New VC?

I’m new to the Syncro scene and need to replace my VC as the old one has gone hard.  Where should I start looking? Is there any one in Australia that is good for parts or should I be looking over seas?


Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.



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4
Michael,
 
It should try crawl over the blocks at a little above idle.  Trying to crawl over at idle is a sign of an aggressive VC but, as stated, this is not necessarily a bad thing.  If you are stalling the engine when trying to do a full lock park, it is very aggressive, but still not terminal.  Terminal is when it is totally locked. 

Les
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 6:22 PM
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Where to get a New VC?

From what I have read, and the little I can under stand.  I believe the VC has become very aggressive.  I have jacked up the back of the syncro placed 2” block under the front wheels and at idle it is tiring to crawl over the blocks.  Hence I have removed the centre driver shaft to prevent any drive line damage.  Are VC available or should I be looking for a decoupler.  If so where do I look for a decoupler?   



----- Original Message ----
From: Les Harris <leslieharris@ optushome. com.au>
To: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 5:49:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Where to get a New VC?

Michael,
 
There are varying degrees of 'going hard', and it is not always detrimental.  As the VC becomes more aggressive, it becomes noticeable when doing full lock turns on a grippy surface - like dry bitumen - and very noticeable in tight supermarket carparks.  In these circumstances, it pays to use the minimum speed possible to reduce the load on the whole driveline.
 
I have found that an aggressive VC actually improves cornering and braking grip.  A further side benefit of this is helping to distribute braking forces, particularly on wet roads, and giving an anti lock effect.
 
The ideal solution is to fit a decoupler, which allows you to decouple the drive to the front diff when parking but otherwise run full time in all wheel drive.
 
Les
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 5:03 PM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Where to get a New VC?

I’m new to the Syncro scene and need to replace my VC as the old one has gone hard.  Where should I start looking? Is there any one in Australia that is good for parts or should I be looking over seas?


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5

Thanks for that, I will look into it a bit more.  I will put the shaft back in and play around to see what happens.

 

Michael



----- Original Message ----
From: Les Harris <leslieharris@optushome.com.au>
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 6:27:04 PM
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Where to get a New VC?

Michael,
 
It should try crawl over the blocks at a little above idle.  Trying to crawl over at idle is a sign of an aggressive VC but, as stated, this is not necessarily a bad thing.  If you are stalling the engine when trying to do a full lock park, it is very aggressive, but still not terminal.  Terminal is when it is totally locked. 

Les
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 6:22 PM
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Where to get a New VC?

From what I have read, and the little I can under stand.  I believe the VC has become very aggressive.  I have jacked up the back of the syncro placed 2” block under the front wheels and at idle it is tiring to crawl over the blocks.  Hence I have removed the centre driver shaft to prevent any drive line damage.  Are VC available or should I be looking for a decoupler.  If so where do I look for a decoupler?   



----- Original Message ----
From: Les Harris <leslieharris@ optushome. com.au>
To: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 5:49:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Where to get a New VC?

Michael,
 
There are varying degrees of 'going hard', and it is not always detrimental.  As the VC becomes more aggressive, it becomes noticeable when doing full lock turns on a grippy surface - like dry bitumen - and very noticeable in tight supermarket carparks.  In these circumstances, it pays to use the minimum speed possible to reduce the load on the whole driveline.
 
I have found that an aggressive VC actually improves cornering and braking grip.  A further side benefit of this is helping to distribute braking forces, particularly on wet roads, and giving an anti lock effect.
 
The ideal solution is to fit a decoupler, which allows you to decouple the drive to the front diff when parking but otherwise run full time in all wheel drive.
 
Les
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 5:03 PM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Where to get a New VC?

I’m new to the Syncro scene and need to replace my VC as the old one has gone hard.  Where should I start looking? Is there any one in Australia that is good for parts or should I be looking over seas?


Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.



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6
I am a new member also and have a 89 trakka camper syncro with a VC
which is starting to show signs of locking. I would like to know if
there is a source of rebuilt VC's in australia. There is a lot of
information about them, and the problem of the liquid ageing, on
american Vanagon forums. I found a supplier in Belgium called busman,
the website is www.busman.be/ but I would prefer to deal with an
australian supplier if there is one. I would like to purchase one so
I can replace mine before it causes any damage.

Andy



--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, Michael Roberts
<type500@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks for that, I will look into it a bit more. I will put the
shaft back in and play around to see what happens.
>
> Michael
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Les Harris <leslieharris@...>
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 6:27:04 PM
> Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Where to get a New VC?
>
> Michael,
>
> It should try crawl over the blocks at a little above idle. Trying
to crawl over at idle is a sign of an aggressive VC but, as stated,
this is not necessarily a bad thing. If you are stalling the engine
when trying to do a full lock park, it is very aggressive, but still
not terminal. Terminal is when it is totally locked.
>
> Les
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Michael Roberts
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com
> Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 6:22 PM
> Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Where to get a New VC?
>
>
> From what I have read, and the little I can under stand. I believe
the VC has become very aggressive. I have jacked up the back of the
syncro placed 2" block under the front wheels and at idle it is
tiring to crawl over the blocks. Hence I have removed the centre
driver shaft to prevent any drive line damage. Are VC available or
should I be looking for a decoupler. If so where do I look for a
decoupler?
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Les Harris <leslieharris@ optushome. com.au>
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com
> Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 5:49:32 PM
> Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Where to get a New VC?
>
>
> Michael,
>
> There are varying degrees of 'going hard', and it is not always
detrimental. As the VC becomes more aggressive, it becomes
noticeable when doing full lock turns on a grippy surface - like dry
bitumen - and very noticeable in tight supermarket carparks. In
these circumstances, it pays to use the minimum speed possible to
reduce the load on the whole driveline.
>
> I have found that an aggressive VC actually improves cornering and
braking grip. A further side benefit of this is helping to
distribute braking forces, particularly on wet roads, and giving an
anti lock effect.
>
> The ideal solution is to fit a decoupler, which allows you to
decouple the drive to the front diff when parking but otherwise run
full time in all wheel drive.
>
> Les
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Michael Roberts
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com
> Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 5:03 PM
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Where to get a New VC?
>
>
> I'm new to the Syncro scene and need to replace my VC as the old
one has gone hard. Where should I start looking? Is there any one in
Australia that is good for parts or should I be looking over seas?
>
>
>
> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
Try it now.
>
>
>
>
>
> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
Try it now.
>
>
>
>
______________________________________________________________________
______________
> Looking for last minute shopping deals?
> Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
>
7
Andy,

First, make sure that your tires are worn similarly, and are inflated to
the same pressures. Otherwise, your VC could be just heating up from the
tires being unmatched and causing the binding in turns.

Larry Hamm
'82 SyncroWesty

andrewbuchan88 wrote:
>
>
> I am a new member also and have a 89 trakka camper syncro with a VC
> which is starting to show signs of locking. I would like to know if
> there is a source of rebuilt VC's in australia. There is a lot of
> information about them, and the problem of the liquid ageing, on
> american Vanagon forums. I found a supplier in Belgium called busman,
> the website is www.busman.be/ but I would prefer to deal with an
> australian supplier if there is one. I would like to purchase one so
> I can replace mine before it causes any damage.
>
> Andy
8
Thanks, Larry, I should have gone through some of the basics as well. 
 
Andy,
 
To expand on what Larry has put in, The VC needs to have an identical diameter on all four tyres.  If it doesn't, there will be a difference between the front and rear axle speeds and the VC will try to correct the speed differential.  The diameters have to be within a few percent of each other because the VC begins to operate when the differential exceeds just a few percent.  The greater the difference, the harder the VC tries to correct the difference.
 
I am just going out at this moment but will be back in a few hours and can send you details of how to measure, with a high degree of accuracy, these vital diameters.
 
Les
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Hamm
Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2008 2:39 PM
Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Where to get a New VC?

Andy,

First, make sure that your tires are worn similarly, and are inflated to
the same pressures. Otherwise, your VC could be just heating up from the
tires being unmatched and causing the binding in turns.

Larry Hamm
'82 SyncroWesty

andrewbuchan88 wrote:
>
>
> I am a new member also and have a 89 trakka camper syncro with a VC
> which is starting to show signs of locking. I would like to know if
> there is a source of rebuilt VC's in australia. There is a lot of
> information about them, and the problem of the liquid ageing, on
> american Vanagon forums. I found a supplier in Belgium called busman,
> the website is www.busman.be/ but I would prefer to deal with an
> australian supplier if there is one. I would like to purchase one so
> I can replace mine before it causes any damage.
>
> Andy

9
Thanks for your replies,
I am aware that differences in tyre diameter will cause the VC to
heat up and engage. I have a set of fairly new tyres fitted that have
been rotated and should be evenly worn, they look OK. I live in
Adelaide and on a recent trip to the NSW north coast I noticed the
binding when pulling into the supermarket carpark in a country town
along the way. I decided to make regular stops every couple of hours
and let the drive train cool down before continuing and limited my
speed to 90km/h. This is OK if you are not pressed for time but I
know when I first bought the van I could travel at 110 km/h all day
on the highway and not notice any binding when pulling into a
roadhouse or wayside stops. I would like to get similar performance
to when it was new. A decoupler may solve the problem but it is a
modification and requires driver input. Originally the VC would only
engage when necessary and not cause any strain on the other
components.
Les, I would like to hear your method for accurately measuring the
wheel diameters, and I would also like to hear from anyone who has
replaced a VC with info on where to get one and how difficult it is
to fit. I am also open to the opinion that the binding is not a bad
thing and any info from someone who has noticed this for a long
period and has not had any further problems as a result would be
welcome.

Andy



--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Les Harris"
<leslieharris@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks, Larry, I should have gone through some of the basics as
well.
>
> Andy,
>
> To expand on what Larry has put in, The VC needs to have an
identical diameter on all four tyres. If it doesn't, there will be a
difference between the front and rear axle speeds and the VC will try
to correct the speed differential. The diameters have to be within a
few percent of each other because the VC begins to operate when the
differential exceeds just a few percent. The greater the difference,
the harder the VC tries to correct the difference.
>
> I am just going out at this moment but will be back in a few hours
and can send you details of how to measure, with a high degree of
accuracy, these vital diameters.
>
> Les
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Larry Hamm
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2008 2:39 PM
> Subject: Re: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Where to get a New VC?
>
>
> Andy,
>
> First, make sure that your tires are worn similarly, and are
inflated to
> the same pressures. Otherwise, your VC could be just heating up
from the
> tires being unmatched and causing the binding in turns.
>
> Larry Hamm
> '82 SyncroWesty
>
> andrewbuchan88 wrote:
> >
> >
> > I am a new member also and have a 89 trakka camper syncro with
a VC
> > which is starting to show signs of locking. I would like to
know if
> > there is a source of rebuilt VC's in australia. There is a lot
of
> > information about them, and the problem of the liquid ageing, on
> > american Vanagon forums. I found a supplier in Belgium called
busman,
> > the website is www.busman.be/ but I would prefer to deal with an
> > australian supplier if there is one. I would like to purchase
one so
> > I can replace mine before it causes any damage.
> >
> > Andy
>
10
Andy,
 
Like everything else, the VC wears with use.  Mine has been 'binding' / 'aggressive' since I bought the vehicle and my coping strategy is to use a decoupler.  If it gets considerably worse, I will look at replacing the VC.  Yes, it is nice to have new vehicle function but that always comes at a cost. 
 
Regarding highway travel, the VC is doing the least work when travelling on the highway because there is almost zero difference between front and rear axle speeds but it still accumulates heat.  Since the operation of the VC is a function of changes in heat in the silicone fluid, you will find that it is 'binding' after a long highway run.  This is not of itself detrimental.  I certainly don't limit my highway speed because my VC is on the aggressive side.  As I have said, it has been that way since I acquired the vehicle and was a result of general, normal operational wear plus the original owner running totally different tyres front and back.
 
I will send the tyre measuring procedure by direct email.
 
Les Harris
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 8:42 PM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Where to get a New VC?

 

Thanks for your replies,
I am aware that differences in tyre diameter will cause the VC to
heat up and engage. I have a set of fairly new tyres fitted that have
been rotated and should be evenly worn, they look OK. I live in
Adelaide and on a recent trip to the NSW north coast I noticed the
binding when pulling into the supermarket carpark in a country town
along the way. I decided to make regular stops every couple of hours
and let the drive train cool down before continuing and limited my
speed to 90km/h. This is OK if you are not pressed for time but I
know when I first bought the van I could travel at 110 km/h all day
on the highway and not notice any binding when pulling into a
roadhouse or wayside stops. I would like to get similar performance
to when it was new. A decoupler may solve the problem but it is a
modification and requires driver input. Originally the VC would only
engage when necessary and not cause any strain on the other
components.
Les, I would like to hear your method for accurately measuring the
wheel diameters, and I would also like to hear from anyone who has
replaced a VC with info on where to get one and how difficult it is
to fit. I am also open to the opinion that the binding is not a bad
thing and any info from someone who has noticed this for a long
period and has not had any further problems as a result would be
welcome.

Andy

.

11
Michael,

be happy that the VC is hard and not empty! Buy a decoupler (costs
less than a new VC!!) and be even happier! Driving with too stiff VC
may feel somewhat nice, but it certainly damages your gearboxes in the
long run, when used on asphalt. Don't do it! Decoupler can also be
bought from various sources...

.martin

On 12.03.2008, at 07:03, Michael Roberts wrote:
> I’m new to the Syncro scene and need to replace my VC as the old one
> has gone hard. Where should I start looking? Is there any one in
> Australia that is good for parts or should I be looking over seas?
>
> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
> Try it now.



--
Martin Henning, DM5OY
martin@easy2design.de
http://log.tigerbus.de
12

Andy,

 

I went through all this when I first got my Syncro 12 years ago.  Originally it had a stiff VC, but I didn’t have the group or the info then, so eventually I had to rebuild the transmission. Having done that I replaced the VC with one I bought through Derek Drew in the States. Last time I saw any-one talking prices a new VC was actually cheaper than a decoupler (at least if bought overseas), and certainly easier to install. I strongly believe the advantages of constant all wheel drive outweigh any perceived advantages of the decoupler. (That’s why I’ve gone with the 4 Motion in my new T5). Having an active VC certainly saved my bacon at least twice that I can recall, in situations when, if I’d had a decoupler, it probably would have been disengaged, and I’d have had no time to engage it.  The guy who purchased my van has reported back a couple of times, and has been very happy with its performance, including in sand driving,  where decoupler proponents say the greatest advantage lies. So you can expect 10 years plus life from a new VC if you replace it, and look after it.

 

I found Derek Drew easy to deal with (you can get his details from the American Syncro site if you don’t already have them), or Mike Plompen may be able to put you on to a European source, or perhaps Rudi knows where to access them.

 

BRIAN REED

FAIRFIELD NATURAL THERAPIES

185 Wingrove St

Fairfield, Vic. 3078

03 9481 5673   0407 319 521

From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com [mailto: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of andrewbuchan88
Sent: Tuesday, 25 March 2008 8:42 PM
To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Where to get a New VC?

 

Thanks for your replies,
I am aware that differences in tyre diameter will cause the VC to
heat up and engage. I have a set of fairly new tyres fitted that have
been rotated and should be evenly worn, they look OK. I live in
Adelaide and on a recent trip to the NSW north coast I noticed the
binding when pulling into the supermarket carpark in a country town
along the way. I decided to make regular stops every couple of hours
and let the drive train cool down before continuing and limited my
speed to 90km/h. This is OK if you are not pressed for time but I
know when I first bought the van I could travel at 110 km/h all day
on the highway and not notice any binding when pulling into a
roadhouse or wayside stops. I would like to get similar performance
to when it was new. A decoupler may solve the problem but it is a
modification and requires driver input. Originally the VC would only
engage when necessary and not cause any strain on the other
components.
Les, I would like to hear your method for accurately measuring the
wheel diameters, and I would also like to hear from anyone who has
replaced a VC with info on where to get one and how difficult it is
to fit. I am also open to the opinion that the binding is not a bad
thing and any info from someone who has noticed this for a long
period and has not had any further problems as a result would be
welcome.

Andy


13

Gday Andy, Brian and ALL,

With the Australia/US $ exchange rate at the moment being better than it once was, check out this site for a new VC, probably as good a source as any at the moment ..

goto http://www.van-cafe.com/vanagon_parts.jsp?pa=p&p=1569295776

Brian, you say "perhaps Rudi knows where to access them." (ie., source VC's) Essentially, Rudi is an advocate of the solid shaft/decoupler configuration, for many reasons, as I learnt on the Syncro 2007 Tour, and I got the strong impression he is not a source of new VC's.

However Andy, instead of fitting a new VC, you say "I am also open to the opinion that the binding is not a bad thing and any info from someone who has noticed this for a long period and has not had any further problems as a result would be welcome."

I think you are asking the impossible. Most members here would agree, and Brian and Martin for starters have essentially said it, you run the risk that you will eventually do expensive damage to one or more drivetrain components if you persist running the aggressive VC as is. As Les says, VC's wear out. So replace it or else make some other choice.

One workaround as Les and others have already done is to add a decoupler.

Or else, simply remove the propshaft. That's the cheapest decoupler.

Or else, do what Rudi and I and others have done, add a decoupler AND replace the VC with a solid shaft.

Andy, it really comes down to what you as an individual perceives as most important/least important when it comes to what you want from your syncro. Clearly, and it shows here on this forum, each member has his/her own perceptions and priorities, which then leads each and every one to making their own individual choice as to how to remedy this issue revolving around the VC. In my view there is NO perfect solution. Each choice offers its own set of advantages and disadvantages. You merely have to decide your own preferred choice and go with it. It's not easy, but you will get there in the end.

Cheers. Ken

 

 

 

 


--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Brian Reed" <breed@...> wrote:
>
> Andy,
>
>
>
> I went through all this when I first got my Syncro 12 years ago. Originally
> it had a stiff VC, but I didn't have the group or the info then, so
> eventually I had to rebuild the transmission. Having done that I replaced
> the VC with one I bought through Derek Drew in the States. Last time I saw
> any-one talking prices a new VC was actually cheaper than a decoupler (at
> least if bought overseas), and certainly easier to install. I strongly
> believe the advantages of constant all wheel drive outweigh any perceived
> advantages of the decoupler. (That's why I've gone with the 4 Motion in my
> new T5). Having an active VC certainly saved my bacon at least twice that I
> can recall, in situations when, if I'd had a decoupler, it probably would
> have been disengaged, and I'd have had no time to engage it. The guy who
> purchased my van has reported back a couple of times, and has been very
> happy with its performance, including in sand driving, where decoupler
> proponents say the greatest advantage lies. So you can expect 10 years plus
> life from a new VC if you replace it, and look after it.
>
>
>
> I found Derek Drew easy to deal with (you can get his details from the
> American Syncro site if you don't already have them), or Mike Plompen may be
> able to put you on to a European source, or perhaps Rudi knows where to
> access them.
>
>
>
> BRIAN REED
>
> FAIRFIELD NATURAL THERAPIES
>
> 185 Wingrove St
>
> Fairfield, Vic. 3078
>
> 03 9481 5673 0407 319 521
>
> _____
>
> From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of andrewbuchan88
> Sent: Tuesday, 25 March 2008 8:42 PM
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Where to get a New VC?
>
>
>
> Thanks for your replies,
> I am aware that differences in tyre diameter will cause the VC to
> heat up and engage. I have a set of fairly new tyres fitted that have
> been rotated and should be evenly worn, they look OK. I live in
> Adelaide and on a recent trip to the NSW north coast I noticed the
> binding when pulling into the supermarket carpark in a country town
> along the way. I decided to make regular stops every couple of hours
> and let the drive train cool down before continuing and limited my
> speed to 90km/h. This is OK if you are not pressed for time but I
> know when I first bought the van I could travel at 110 km/h all day
> on the highway and not notice any binding when pulling into a
> roadhouse or wayside stops. I would like to get similar performance
> to when it was new. A decoupler may solve the problem but it is a
> modification and requires driver input. Originally the VC would only
> engage when necessary and not cause any strain on the other
> components.
> Les, I would like to hear your method for accurately measuring the
> wheel diameters, and I would also like to hear from anyone who has
> replaced a VC with info on where to get one and how difficult it is
> to fit. I am also open to the opinion that the binding is not a bad
> thing and any info from someone who has noticed this for a long
> period and has not had any further problems as a result would be
> welcome.
>
> Andy
>

14

Thanks for all the information on VC's. 

It finally rained here so I got to see how the VC actually workd.  In wet clay going through gutters the rear wheels start to spin a fraction before the fronts appear to grip and pull me forward.  So I’m happy that the VC is not to aggressive at this stage.  I still need a new VC for a syncro has totally failed, but will look off shore. 

The next question that arises is “How effective is a syncro with one front and rear wheel slipping”.  I have seen that a syncro with a faulty VC in clay can not drive out of a gutter due to wheel spin.  So if a front wheel starts to spin also with a good VC what happens? Does all the torque escape to the unloaded wheels?  Or is this the time that a rear diff lock is required?



Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
15
Gday Michael,

For starters, it's impossible to give an opinion about a wet clay
scenario when we have no clue what tyres you are running and what
condition they are in. Maybe your tyres are the root problem. Offroad
tyres would obviously do better than street tyres. Mud & Snow tyres may
do better than AT tyres.

An aggressive VC may help reduce wheel spin in wet clay to some degree.

With one forward and one aft wheel spinning at the same time, a stock
standard syncro is going nowhere.

Adding one or more diflocks may then make the difference between being
left spinning in clay or moving out, assuming all wheels aren't up in
the air (ie., syncro is sitting on the skidrails). But if the diflock/s
isn't already engaged BEFORE you get into strife, then it's essentially
pure luck that they engage AFTER you are stuck. In one revolution of a
wheel, there are only three potential diflock engagement positions.

There's a lot to be said for having a field day to learn how to operate
the syncro offroad in a range of scenarios and seeing how syncros with
different drivetrain configurations may offer different outcomes,
bearing in mind however the varying skill levels of drivers and
different tyres/performance on participating vehicles.

Michael, you may prefer a Hummer ... lol. Cheers.

Ken




--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, Michael Roberts
<type500@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks for all the information on VC's.
> It finally rained here so I got to see how the VC actually workd. In
wet clay going through gutters the rear wheels start to spin a fraction
before the fronts appear to grip and pull me forward. So I'm happy
that the VC is not to aggressive at this stage. I still need a new VC
for a syncro has totally failed, but will look off shore.
> The next question that arises is "How effective is a syncro with
one front and rear wheel slipping". I have seen that a syncro with a
faulty VC in clay can not drive out of a gutter due to wheel spin. So if
a front wheel starts to spin also with a good VC what happens? Does all
the torque escape to the unloaded wheels? Or is this the time that a
rear diff lock is required?
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________\
____________
> Looking for last minute shopping deals?
> Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
>
16
Thanks Les,
It is good to know that you can continue to drive the vehicle
normally and not cause major problems with an aggressive VC. Some
other owners are more alarmist about this. I replaced all four tyres
at once with the same size all round and have rotated them front to
rear so the wear should be even but would like to check anyhow.
I think it might be cheaper to buy and fit a reconditioned VC rather
than a decoupler.

andy buchan


--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Les Harris"
<leslieharris@...> wrote:
>
> Andy,
>
> Like everything else, the VC wears with use. Mine has
been 'binding' / 'aggressive' since I bought the vehicle and my
coping strategy is to use a decoupler. If it gets considerably
worse, I will look at replacing the VC. Yes, it is nice to have new
vehicle function but that always comes at a cost.
>
> Regarding highway travel, the VC is doing the least work when
travelling on the highway because there is almost zero difference
between front and rear axle speeds but it still accumulates heat.
Since the operation of the VC is a function of changes in heat in the
silicone fluid, you will find that it is 'binding' after a long
highway run. This is not of itself detrimental. I certainly don't
limit my highway speed because my VC is on the aggressive side. As I
have said, it has been that way since I acquired the vehicle and was
a result of general, normal operational wear plus the original owner
running totally different tyres front and back.
>
> I will send the tyre measuring procedure by direct email.
>
> Les Harris
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: andrewbuchan88
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 8:42 PM
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Where to get a New VC?
>
>
> Thanks for your replies,
> I am aware that differences in tyre diameter will cause the VC to
> heat up and engage. I have a set of fairly new tyres fitted that
have
> been rotated and should be evenly worn, they look OK. I live in
> Adelaide and on a recent trip to the NSW north coast I noticed
the
> binding when pulling into the supermarket carpark in a country
town
> along the way. I decided to make regular stops every couple of
hours
> and let the drive train cool down before continuing and limited
my
> speed to 90km/h. This is OK if you are not pressed for time but I
> know when I first bought the van I could travel at 110 km/h all
day
> on the highway and not notice any binding when pulling into a
> roadhouse or wayside stops. I would like to get similar
performance
> to when it was new. A decoupler may solve the problem but it is a
> modification and requires driver input. Originally the VC would
only
> engage when necessary and not cause any strain on the other
> components.
> Les, I would like to hear your method for accurately measuring
the
> wheel diameters, and I would also like to hear from anyone who
has
> replaced a VC with info on where to get one and how difficult it
is
> to fit. I am also open to the opinion that the binding is not a
bad
> thing and any info from someone who has noticed this for a long
> period and has not had any further problems as a result would be
> welcome.
>
> Andy
>
>
> Recent Activity
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>
> Groups to help you
>
> look & feel great.
>
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>
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>
> entertainment news
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>
> our award-winning
>
> e-commerce tools.
> .
>
17
Thanks brian,
Your information re-inforces what I have found so far on american
forums that it is better to replace the VC (and cheaper) than fit a
decoupler or rebuild the front differential which will wear out
prematurely with an aggressive VC.
I will have a look for Derek Drew or Mike Plompen on the american
site and see how their prices compare with the recon VC from Belgium.

andrew buchan


--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Brian Reed" <breed@...>
wrote:
>
> Andy,
>
>
>
> I went through all this when I first got my Syncro 12 years ago.
Originally
> it had a stiff VC, but I didn't have the group or the info then, so
> eventually I had to rebuild the transmission. Having done that I
replaced
> the VC with one I bought through Derek Drew in the States. Last
time I saw
> any-one talking prices a new VC was actually cheaper than a
decoupler (at
> least if bought overseas), and certainly easier to install. I
strongly
> believe the advantages of constant all wheel drive outweigh any
perceived
> advantages of the decoupler. (That's why I've gone with the 4
Motion in my
> new T5). Having an active VC certainly saved my bacon at least
twice that I
> can recall, in situations when, if I'd had a decoupler, it probably
would
> have been disengaged, and I'd have had no time to engage it. The
guy who
> purchased my van has reported back a couple of times, and has been
very
> happy with its performance, including in sand driving, where
decoupler
> proponents say the greatest advantage lies. So you can expect 10
years plus
> life from a new VC if you replace it, and look after it.
>
>
>
> I found Derek Drew easy to deal with (you can get his details from
the
> American Syncro site if you don't already have them), or Mike
Plompen may be
> able to put you on to a European source, or perhaps Rudi knows
where to
> access them.
>
>
>
> BRIAN REED
>
> FAIRFIELD NATURAL THERAPIES
>
> 185 Wingrove St
>
> Fairfield, Vic. 3078
>
> 03 9481 5673 0407 319 521
>
> _____
>
> From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
andrewbuchan88
> Sent: Tuesday, 25 March 2008 8:42 PM
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Where to get a New VC?
>
>
>
> Thanks for your replies,
> I am aware that differences in tyre diameter will cause the VC to
> heat up and engage. I have a set of fairly new tyres fitted that
have
> been rotated and should be evenly worn, they look OK. I live in
> Adelaide and on a recent trip to the NSW north coast I noticed the
> binding when pulling into the supermarket carpark in a country town
> along the way. I decided to make regular stops every couple of
hours
> and let the drive train cool down before continuing and limited my
> speed to 90km/h. This is OK if you are not pressed for time but I
> know when I first bought the van I could travel at 110 km/h all day
> on the highway and not notice any binding when pulling into a
> roadhouse or wayside stops. I would like to get similar performance
> to when it was new. A decoupler may solve the problem but it is a
> modification and requires driver input. Originally the VC would
only
> engage when necessary and not cause any strain on the other
> components.
> Les, I would like to hear your method for accurately measuring the
> wheel diameters, and I would also like to hear from anyone who has
> replaced a VC with info on where to get one and how difficult it is
> to fit. I am also open to the opinion that the binding is not a bad
> thing and any info from someone who has noticed this for a long
> period and has not had any further problems as a result would be
> welcome.
>
> Andy
>
18
Thanks Ken,
I am convinced from all that I have read about the VC ageing process
that it is definately best to replace it or fit a decoupler or damage
to the drive train will occur. You are right that there are a lot of
different opinions about what is the best remedy. I haven't decided
yet but am leaning towards replacing it if I can find a good source.
I will check out the link to vanagon parts you have supplied.

cheers
andy



--- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Ken" <unclekenz@...>
wrote:
>
>
> Gday Andy, Brian and ALL,
>
> With the Australia/US $ exchange rate at the moment being better
than it
> once was, check out this site for a new VC, probably as good a
source as
> any at the moment ..
>
> goto http://www.van-cafe.com/vanagon_parts.jsp?pa=p&p=1569295776
> <http://www.van-cafe.com/vanagon_parts.jsp?pa=p&p=1569295776>
>
> Brian, you say "perhaps Rudi knows where to access them." (ie.,
source
> VC's) Essentially, Rudi is an advocate of the solid shaft/decoupler
> configuration, for many reasons, as I learnt on the Syncro 2007
Tour,
> and I got the strong impression he is not a source of new VC's.
>
> However Andy, instead of fitting a new VC, you say "I am also open
to
> the opinion that the binding is not a bad thing and any info from
> someone who has noticed this for a long period and has not had any
> further problems as a result would be welcome."
>
> I think you are asking the impossible. Most members here would
agree,
> and Brian and Martin for starters have essentially said it, you run
the
> risk that you will eventually do expensive damage to one or more
> drivetrain components if you persist running the aggressive VC as
is. As
> Les says, VC's wear out. So replace it or else make some other
choice.
>
> One workaround as Les and others have already done is to add a
> decoupler.
>
> Or else, simply remove the propshaft. That's the cheapest decoupler.
>
> Or else, do what Rudi and I and others have done, add a decoupler
AND
> replace the VC with a solid shaft.
>
> Andy, it really comes down to what you as an individual perceives as
> most important/least important when it comes to what you want from
your
> syncro. Clearly, and it shows here on this forum, each member has
> his/her own perceptions and priorities, which then leads each and
every
> one to making their own individual choice as to how to remedy this
issue
> revolving around the VC. In my view there is NO perfect solution.
Each
> choice offers its own set of advantages and disadvantages. You
merely
> have to decide your own preferred choice and go with it. It's not
easy,
> but you will get there in the end.
>
> Cheers. Ken
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Brian Reed" <breed@>
> wrote:
> >
> > Andy,
> >
> >
> >
> > I went through all this when I first got my Syncro 12 years ago.
> Originally
> > it had a stiff VC, but I didn't have the group or the info then,
so
> > eventually I had to rebuild the transmission. Having done that I
> replaced
> > the VC with one I bought through Derek Drew in the States. Last
time I
> saw
> > any-one talking prices a new VC was actually cheaper than a
decoupler
> (at
> > least if bought overseas), and certainly easier to install. I
strongly
> > believe the advantages of constant all wheel drive outweigh any
> perceived
> > advantages of the decoupler. (That's why I've gone with the 4
Motion
> in my
> > new T5). Having an active VC certainly saved my bacon at least
twice
> that I
> > can recall, in situations when, if I'd had a decoupler, it
probably
> would
> > have been disengaged, and I'd have had no time to engage it. The
guy
> who
> > purchased my van has reported back a couple of times, and has been
> very
> > happy with its performance, including in sand driving, where
decoupler
> > proponents say the greatest advantage lies. So you can expect 10
years
> plus
> > life from a new VC if you replace it, and look after it.
> >
> >
> >
> > I found Derek Drew easy to deal with (you can get his details
from the
> > American Syncro site if you don't already have them), or Mike
Plompen
> may be
> > able to put you on to a European source, or perhaps Rudi knows
where
> to
> > access them.
> >
> >
> >
> > BRIAN REED
> >
> > FAIRFIELD NATURAL THERAPIES
> >
> > 185 Wingrove St
> >
> > Fairfield, Vic. 3078
> >
> > 03 9481 5673 0407 319 521
> >
> > _____
> >
> > From: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > [mailto:Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
> andrewbuchan88
> > Sent: Tuesday, 25 March 2008 8:42 PM
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Where to get a New VC?
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks for your replies,
> > I am aware that differences in tyre diameter will cause the VC to
> > heat up and engage. I have a set of fairly new tyres fitted that
have
> > been rotated and should be evenly worn, they look OK. I live in
> > Adelaide and on a recent trip to the NSW north coast I noticed the
> > binding when pulling into the supermarket carpark in a country
town
> > along the way. I decided to make regular stops every couple of
hours
> > and let the drive train cool down before continuing and limited my
> > speed to 90km/h. This is OK if you are not pressed for time but I
> > know when I first bought the van I could travel at 110 km/h all
day
> > on the highway and not notice any binding when pulling into a
> > roadhouse or wayside stops. I would like to get similar
performance
> > to when it was new. A decoupler may solve the problem but it is a
> > modification and requires driver input. Originally the VC would
only
> > engage when necessary and not cause any strain on the other
> > components.
> > Les, I would like to hear your method for accurately measuring the
> > wheel diameters, and I would also like to hear from anyone who has
> > replaced a VC with info on where to get one and how difficult it
is
> > to fit. I am also open to the opinion that the binding is not a
bad
> > thing and any info from someone who has noticed this for a long
> > period and has not had any further problems as a result would be
> > welcome.
> >
> > Andy
> >
>
19
Andrew,
 
Mike Plompen is the Belgium man:
 
Another source is Bernd Jaeger:
 
And there are several US suppliers. 
 
Given the strength of the Australian dollar, both Europe and the US are good deals.
 
There is no doubt that a new VC is the best path.  The Syncro system (read Steyer Puch) is extremely good and works extremely well.  The reason that I went to a decoupler was that I was quite happy with the more aggressive function of the VC so decided to keep it for now. 
 
I was also interested in the fuel consumption question.  At that time, there was a lot of speculation and many wild claims on the various groups to the effect that running decoupled would give massive improvements in fuel consumption.  As a motor vehicle engineer of some experience, I had big doubts about that, so I ran a test over 30,000 km using both modes.  The outcome was that I got (on identical running) 0.8 km per litre BETTER fuel consumption in AWD.
 
One last word of warning; there are some 'reconditioned' VC's on the market about which there have been some questions as to whether the reconditioner/s actually knew what they were doing.  I would go for a new one rather than a reconditioned.
 
Les
 
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, March 28, 2008 10:02 AM
Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Where to get a New VC?

Thanks Les,
It is good to know that you can continue to drive the vehicle
normally and not cause major problems with an aggressive VC. Some
other owners are more alarmist about this. I replaced all four tyres
at once with the same size all round and have rotated them front to
rear so the wear should be even but would like to check anyhow.
I think it might be cheaper to buy and fit a reconditioned VC rather
than a decoupler.

andy buchan

--- In Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com, "Les Harris"
<leslieharris@ ...> wrote:
>
> Andy,
>
> Like everything else, the VC wears with use. Mine has
been 'binding' / 'aggressive' since I bought the vehicle and my
coping strategy is to use a decoupler. If it gets considerably
worse, I will look at replacing the VC. Yes, it is nice to have new
vehicle function but that always comes at a cost.
>
> Regarding highway travel, the VC is doing the least work when
travelling on the highway because there is almost zero difference
between front and rear axle speeds but it still accumulates heat.
Since the operation of the VC is a function of changes in heat in the
silicone fluid, you will find that it is 'binding' after a long
highway run. This is not of itself detrimental. I certainly don't
limit my highway speed because my VC is on the aggressive side. As I
have said, it has been that way since I acquired the vehicle and was
a result of general, normal operational wear plus the original owner
running totally different tyres front and back.
>
> I will send the tyre measuring procedure by direct email.
>
> Les Harris
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: andrewbuchan88
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia @yahoogroups. com
> Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 8:42 PM
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australi a] Re: Where to get a New VC?
>
>
> Thanks for your replies,
> I am aware that differences in tyre diameter will cause the VC to
> heat up and engage. I have a set of fairly new tyres fitted that
have
> been rotated and should be evenly worn, they look OK. I live in
> Adelaide and on a recent trip to the NSW north coast I noticed
the
> binding when pulling into the supermarket carpark in a country
town
> along the way. I decided to make regular stops every couple of
hours
> and let the drive train cool down before continuing and limited
my
> speed to 90km/h. This is OK if you are not pressed for time but I
> know when I first bought the van I could travel at 110 km/h all
day
> on the highway and not notice any binding when pulling into a
> roadhouse or wayside stops. I would like to get similar
performance
> to when it was new. A decoupler may solve the problem but it is a
> modification and requires driver input. Originally the VC would
only
> engage when necessary and not cause any strain on the other
> components.
> Les, I would like to hear your method for accurately measuring
the
> wheel diameters, and I would also like to hear from anyone who
has
> replaced a VC with info on where to get one and how difficult it
is
> to fit. I am also open to the opinion that the binding is not a
bad
> thing and any info from someone who has noticed this for a long
> period and has not had any further problems as a result would be
> welcome.
>
> Andy
>
>
> Recent Activity
> a.. 1New Members
> Visit Your Group
> Health Zone
> Look your best!
>
> Groups to help you
>
> look & feel great.
>
> Yahoo! News
> Get it all here
>
> Breaking news to
>
> entertainment news
>
> Sell Online
> Start selling with
>
> our award-winning
>
> e-commerce tools.
> .
>

20
Has anyone priced one in Australia?

Phill


> Les Harris <leslieharris@optushome.com.au> wrote:
>
> Andrew,
>
> Mike Plompen is the Belgium man:
> http://www.busman.be/
>
> Another source is Bernd Jaeger:
> http://www.syncro-bernd-jaeger.de/
>
> And there are several US suppliers.
>
> Given the strength of the Australian dollar, both Europe and the US are
> good deals.
>
> There is no doubt that a new VC is the best path. The Syncro system
> (read Steyer Puch) is extremely good and works extremely well. The
> reason that I went to a decoupler was that I was quite happy with the
> more aggressive function of the VC so decided to keep it for now.
>
> I was also interested in the fuel consumption question. At that time,
> there was a lot of speculation and many wild claims on the various
> groups to the effect that running decoupled would give massive
> improvements in fuel consumption. As a motor vehicle engineer of some
> experience, I had big doubts about that, so I ran a test over 30,000 km
> using both modes. The outcome was that I got (on identical running) 0.8
> km per litre BETTER fuel consumption in AWD.
>
> One last word of warning; there are some 'reconditioned' VC's on the
> market about which there have been some questions as to whether the
> reconditioner/s actually knew what they were doing. I would go for a
> new one rather than a reconditioned.
>
> Les
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: andrewbuchan88
> To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Friday, March 28, 2008 10:02 AM
> Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Where to get a New VC?
>
>
> Thanks Les,
> It is good to know that you can continue to drive the vehicle
> normally and not cause major problems with an aggressive VC. Some
> other owners are more alarmist about this. I replaced all four tyres
> at once with the same size all round and have rotated them front to
> rear so the wear should be even but would like to check anyhow.
> I think it might be cheaper to buy and fit a reconditioned VC rather
> than a decoupler.
>
> andy buchan
>
> --- In Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com, "Les Harris"
> <leslieharris@...> wrote:
> >
> > Andy,
> >
> > Like everything else, the VC wears with use. Mine has
> been 'binding' / 'aggressive' since I bought the vehicle and my
> coping strategy is to use a decoupler. If it gets considerably
> worse, I will look at replacing the VC. Yes, it is nice to have new
> vehicle function but that always comes at a cost.
> >
> > Regarding highway travel, the VC is doing the least work when
> travelling on the highway because there is almost zero difference
> between front and rear axle speeds but it still accumulates heat.
> Since the operation of the VC is a function of changes in heat in the
> silicone fluid, you will find that it is 'binding' after a long
> highway run. This is not of itself detrimental. I certainly don't
> limit my highway speed because my VC is on the aggressive side. As I
> have said, it has been that way since I acquired the vehicle and was
> a result of general, normal operational wear plus the original owner
> running totally different tyres front and back.
> >
> > I will send the tyre measuring procedure by direct email.
> >
> > Les Harris
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: andrewbuchan88
> > To: Syncro_T3_Australia@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 8:42 PM
> > Subject: [Syncro_T3_Australia] Re: Where to get a New VC?
> >
> >
> > Thanks for your replies,
> > I am aware that differences in tyre diameter will cause the VC to
> > heat up and engage. I have a set of fairly new tyres fitted that
> have
> > been rotated and should be evenly worn, they look OK. I live in
> > Adelaide and on a recent trip to the NSW north coast I noticed
> the
> > binding when pulling into the supermarket carpark in a country
> town
> > along the way. I decided to make regular stops every couple of
> hours
> > and let the drive train cool down before continuing and limited
> my
> > speed to 90km/h. This is OK if you are not pressed for time but I
> > know when I first bought the van I could travel at 110 km/h all
> day
> > on the highway and not notice any binding when pulling into a
> > roadhouse or wayside stops. I would like to get similar
> performance
> > to when it was new. A decoupler may solve the problem but it is a
> > modification and requires driver input. Originally the VC would
> only
> > engage when necessary and not cause any strain on the other
> > components.
> > Les, I would like to hear your method for accurately measuring
> the
> > wheel diameters, and I would also like to hear from anyone who
> has
> > replaced a VC with info on where to get one and how difficult it
> is
> > to fit. I am also open to the opinion that the binding is not a
> bad
> > thing and any info from someone who has noticed this for a long
> > period and has not had any further problems as a result would be
> > welcome.
> >
> > Andy
> >
> >
> > Recent Activity
> > a.. 1New Members
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